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Steven Barrett
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Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 01:06 pm |
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Just got this from Chuck Colson's PFM
Why Christian Women Marry Muslim Men
A Wake-Up Call
November 1, 2007
Note: This commentary was delivered by PFM President Mark Earley.
It was while vacationing in Turkey that Miriam, a British subject, became fascinated with Islam. She was mesmerized by the beauty of the mosques and spellbound as she heard the daily calls to prayer. Miriam had been raised a Christian, but had turned against God when her mother died. The simplicity and security that Islam seemed to offer appealed to her: She decided to convert and married a Muslim man.
But within a few years, cracks began to form in her new faith. She felt that she could never be good enough to earn a place in Paradise, and that God did not love her. One day Miriam picked up her old Bible, and a few months later, re-embraced her commitment to Christ. But when Miriam told her husband what she had done, he promptly left her and their little girl. Islamic law required it: She was now an apostate.
Miriam tells her story in a new book by Rosemary Sookhdeo titled Why Christian Women Convert to Islam. What is shocking is how many of these women come from strong, evangelical backgrounds. Many converts, like Miriam, are brought up by Christian parents, accept Christ, and get involved in church activities. But as they grow older, their commitment fades, or they become disillusioned with Christianity. Islam, they think, may offer the answer.
Younger women often meet Muslims at college—men who convince them that there is really not much difference between Islam and Christianity. When their wives discover the truth that Christianity is not the same as Islam, it is often too late. Any children they have will be raised Muslim-and great pressure is put on wives to convert.
Some women marry with the best of intentions: Their husbands are recent Muslim converts to Christianity. The women learn later that they should have put off wedding plans in order to test the strength of this commitment, because all too often, these men convert back to Islam when their families pressure them.
The sobering truth is that the number of Christian converts to Islam is growing rapidly. Sookhdeo says that when her husband recently spoke at a major Christian conference, he asked the audience how many of them knew someone who had converted to Islam. Fifty percent of the audience raised a hand—astonishing!
Sookhdeo believes that some 30,000 Westerners have converted to Islam in the last decade—the majority of them women. Clearly, our churches need to do something about this. In Sunday school classes and youth groups, we need to teach our kids, especially our daughters, about the difference between Islam and Christianity. And we cannot forget the role that Christian education plays here. We must remind them of the Apostle Paul's admonition in Second Corinthians that we not be yoked with unbelievers.
As more and more Muslims immigrate to Western countries, Christians will likely find themselves mixing with them at work, in the college classroom, and in their neighborhoods. While we should welcome opportunities to develop friendships and share our life and faith, marriage is altogether different.
If you know young Christians tempted to marry outside the faith, talk to them. Pray for them. And ask your church family for support. We must do all we can to help our children remain faithful to the one true God and His only Son, who alone died for our sins: Jesus the Christ.
"... cracks began to form ..." An ominous choice of words, don't you think?
____________________
For anyone suffering from a mental illness or has a loved one with a mental illness, my book "Lead kindly Light: A Devotional For The Mentally Ill" might be of some help: http://www.lulu.com/ (Use search box at the top of page.)
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Steven Barrett
Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 01:10 pm |
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| Of course, she could try and become an Episco-Muslim!
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For anyone suffering from a mental illness or has a loved one with a mental illness, my book "Lead kindly Light: A Devotional For The Mentally Ill" might be of some help: http://www.lulu.com/ (Use search box at the top of page.)
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Annie
Member
| Joined: | Wed Feb 14th, 2007 |
| Location: | Columbus, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 718 |
| First Name: | Annie | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nothing, Quaker, Mennonite, Presbyterian, Methodist, Anglican, Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 01:22 pm |
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My feeling is that the women who convert to Islam, at least American-born ones, have a need to be controlled. They are the same kind of women who marry abusive men. I think there is also a desire to return to a past that never really existed. Both of these are pathologies of course, which we are all prone to in one way or another.
Trying not to be pathological,
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Annie
Ora et labora
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CajunRick
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 4981 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 01:49 pm |
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Steven Barrett wrote: Of course, she could try and become an Episco-Muslim!
Or a Muscopalian...
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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AggieCatholic
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | San Antonio, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 82 |
| First Name: | Lance | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | United Methodist to Roman Catholic (Anglican Use) |
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Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 01:55 pm |
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| Islamapalian sounds cooler.
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What part of, "Hoc est enim Corpus meum" don't you understand?
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Annie
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| Joined: | Wed Feb 14th, 2007 |
| Location: | Columbus, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 718 |
| First Name: | Annie | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nothing, Quaker, Mennonite, Presbyterian, Methodist, Anglican, Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 03:36 pm |
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I used to be a Quennopresbymetholican.
At least nobody threatened to kill me when I became Catholic. I just got funny looks and lost two "friends."
Last edited on Thu Nov 1st, 2007 03:37 pm by Annie
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Annie
Ora et labora
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Br_Carlo
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Tyler, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 153 |
| First Name: | Br_Carlo (Vince Brach) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Presbyterian, Episcopalian, CATHOLIC |
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Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 10:54 pm |
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| God's peace. Although much of the response to this serious message has been light, I must add that the desire of many Evangelical women to become Muslims may stem from the denigrating and subservient position given women in the Protestant ecclesial communities. Mary, in particular, is referred to with immense disrespect--as if she were a clay pot or a pumpkin out of which Christ sprang! Only in the Catholic Church does womankind receive the dignity that it richly deserves, and this in itself may protect women from the siren call of the apostasy of Islam. Blessings, ~Br_Carlo~ Last edited on Thu Nov 1st, 2007 10:56 pm by Br_Carlo
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Steven Barrett
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Posted: Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 11:37 am |
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Now that Imus is coming back, I'd like to have his take on this. He'd better not say nary a word until the ink is dry on his contract.
Anyway, what I do have is a related comment given years ago by most reliable Catholic insider when it comes to understanding how the family ought and ought not to be started up with some folks. (Or simply not started at all!)
Saith the late and much beloved Henri Nouwen:
" ... it is indeed amazing... that men and women whohave had such distressing relationships with their parents, brothers, or sisters can throw themselves blindly intorelationships with far-reaching consequences in the hope that from now on, things will be totally different."
I sure wish I had something like that framed and posted in my office while I was a state probation/parole officer in Florida's Orange county area back in 1980 -- especially when I had to match the family crimes with the family trees. (And underneath the damn sign I'd have another one saying KISS.)
These ladies haven't a clue unless they lived in some of our worst trailer camps what they've stepped into. Yes, that's "classicist," or whatever-else-ist,
it certainly sho' ain't PC-ist, but these gals do need a lot of prayers, a "frank and not-so-mutual pre-nuptial 'dialogue'" and failing that, a rich uncle with deep pockets who can afford something like those "contractor" outfits working in Iraq to pull these girls back into the civilized world. But not into what Nouwen or Annie described. There are a lot of good decent guys who give 'em a safe home without the wrath of Allah.Last edited on Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 11:43 am by Steven Barrett
____________________
For anyone suffering from a mental illness or has a loved one with a mental illness, my book "Lead kindly Light: A Devotional For The Mentally Ill" might be of some help: http://www.lulu.com/ (Use search box at the top of page.)
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kimdyuma
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Arizona USA |
| Posts: | 710 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | cradle Anglican, Episcopal /Catholic-04/07/07 |
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Posted: Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 11:53 am |
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| That is an old familiar tale- you don't know how many women I met in Bangladesh married to Bangladeshis who thought that they were marrying well off ( or at least middle class) men to find them selves in little hovels with umpteen family members and being low woman on the totem pole with any number of children trapping them and their children into a poverty stricken HARD life often with no running water or electricity cooking over open fires and isolated from her family and former friends
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Adopt from your local Humane Society- Please spay or neuter your pets
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Credo Catholic
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| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Greenville, South Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 1212 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 01:55 pm |
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| How do you teach your children to be tolerant and not be bigots, and yet teach them not to marry outside the faith? It's an important lesson, it would save them from so much heartache later. As a catholic now, if I were still raising children, I would stress the importance of being in communion with the church, in communion with the saints, how important it is to remain with the true church and not wander. Being tolerant should not mean they have to accept another religion as their own. I remember the movie with Sally Fields called "Not Without My Daughter" about a woman married to a muslim. They visited Iran to see his family and she was not allowed to return to the U.S. She finally escaped with her daughter. It's based on a true story. The final scene showed her arriving at a U.S. embassy in another country (Turkey?) and the Stars and Stripes flapping in the breeze over her head. It brought tears to my eyes.
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David W. Emery
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Brownsville, Texas USA |
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Posted: Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 02:56 pm |
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Credo Catholic wrote:How do you teach your children to be tolerant and not be bigots, and yet teach them not to marry outside the faith? It's an important lesson, it would save them from so much heartache later. As a catholic now, if I were still raising children, I would stress the importance of being in communion with the church, in communion with the saints, how important it is to remain with the true church and not wander.
It’s about charity rather than “love” or “tolerance.” There is a difference. Yes, “communion” is part of charity.
David
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Steven Barrett
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Posted: Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 03:31 pm |
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Any time the Muslims want to play by the same rules we do in this nation regarding religious freedom instead of putting their culture above the common law of God, our laws, and respect for the rights of non-Muslims (in any society) then perhaps we can relax a bit more. In the meantime, there's nothing wrong with diligence. This is especially important when international laws as they pertain to child custody are concerned.
We've got a State Department that down through the years has been a wide open nest of pro-Arabists and fellow appeasers who don't have spine or recognition of their first duties as American citizens. And it's not just pro-Arabists, the Iranians have a sympathetic ear in Foggy Bottom. The State Dept. has long been a hideout for WASPs and anti-Semites of the worst kind.
This is all the more reason for parents to do whatever they can to put a Kabosh on this development. It's not even cul-de-sac. It's a one-way street to Riyadh, Baghdad, Teheran, Kuwait City, Doha, Cairo, Amman, the West Bank and God knows where because we have our foreign service tucked into the oil barons' back pockets. Why? Well, they'll cowardly hide behind the oil card saying you have a choice between granny getting frozen out this winter because oil prices will skyrocket if we get these guys upset by criticising their special mysoginistic culture -- and granny never getting to see her grandkids again.
Most State Department workers aren't this malignantly cynical, but their department has had a long history of pro-arabist/muslim appeasement, much like their British counterparts today and before WWII.
In the meantime, make damn sure your daughters don't fall for the SheiksofAraby and all their promises of stability. Stability--hogwash!
And as for communion, they've got a long distance from the table to move forward on. A real long way, spiritually, culturally and legally.
____________________
For anyone suffering from a mental illness or has a loved one with a mental illness, my book "Lead kindly Light: A Devotional For The Mentally Ill" might be of some help: http://www.lulu.com/ (Use search box at the top of page.)
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Annie
Member
| Joined: | Wed Feb 14th, 2007 |
| Location: | Columbus, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 718 |
| First Name: | Annie | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nothing, Quaker, Mennonite, Presbyterian, Methodist, Anglican, Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 03:42 pm |
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| Around my neck of the woods, the state has started to recognize Shar'ia law as on a par with ours and this concerns me. We have roughly 20,000 Somalians here, some of the women came here to get away from Shar'ia and here they have it again. An example is the prevalence of what we call "spousal abuse," which is actionable and apparently sometimes the state is allowing Shar'ia to take over even when the abused person wishes to file a formal complaint in our court system. That is so wrong.
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Annie
Ora et labora
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Credo Catholic
Member
| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
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| Posts: | 1212 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 04:18 pm |
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Steven Barrett wrote: And as for communion, they've got a long distance from the table to move forward on. A real long way, spiritually, culturally and legally.
That's what I'm saying. Don't excuse your daughter from the table!
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Steven Barrett
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Posted: Mon Nov 5th, 2007 09:47 am |
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None of my daughters will be excluded. Needn't worry about that. I was a prodigal hell-raiser and my good Catholic parents who taught the Bible through example(s) -- beaucoup examples -- welcomed me back from my stint with Baal, excuse me, Budweiser, for being a lot less weiser. But Allah, Sha ria law and all that? Lawdy it's enough to turn me back into a hedonistic Parrothead for good.
Seriously though. You raise a good point and our hearts and doors should always be open. My parents taught me that through their examples and no matter how painful our kids can be, we must always follow our far more benevolent Savior's teachings, lest we become more of his favorite targets, Pharisees.
I lived in Morocco a half century ago and have had wonderfully fond memories of living in a nation that was predominately Muslim. It wasn't an "Islamic state." There was no official segregation, which I'm afraid has seeped back in there through the hardliners. Please somebody correct me if I'm off base on this. Nevertheless, I can still recall getting separated in a market and never have had to worry for my safety. I doubt if even nowadays except in Baghdad or Mogidishu I've had to worry. Kids were off-limits.
Morocco? Nope. People are pretty much the same when it comes to kids, except where liberals have turned the sexual mores upside down as they have done in this land. In some respects, I have to hand it to the Muslims, especially in the more developed Muslim lands; not of course, Sudan or places like it where child and female slavery is part of its economic "system."
It's a mixed bag, that I'll admit. But let's face it, we, especially our women, can do without the hardened kind of nuts.
s.
____________________
For anyone suffering from a mental illness or has a loved one with a mental illness, my book "Lead kindly Light: A Devotional For The Mentally Ill" might be of some help: http://www.lulu.com/ (Use search box at the top of page.)
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ASimpleSinner
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| First Name: | Simple | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Byzantine Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2008 04:25 am |
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Annie wrote: My feeling is that the women who convert to Islam, at least American-born ones, have a need to be controlled. They are the same kind of women who marry abusive men. I think there is also a desire to return to a past that never really existed. Both of these are pathologies of course, which we are all prone to in one way or another.
Trying not to be pathological,
However unpopular this may be for saying... in my experience I have found the same. The three women I know who have gone from WASP homes to wearing a headscarf had remarkably low self-esteem. They were over-weight, had distant or absent fathers, and came under the sway of exotic men who made them feel special.
People lambaste more traditional Catholic stances against mixed marriages of this sort... but it was there for a reason.
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