 |
| Author | Post |
|---|
Faramir
Member
| Joined: | Fri Jan 25th, 2008 |
| Location: | Lexington, Kentucky USA |
| Posts: | 9 |
| First Name: | Steven | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Baptist, being drawn to the Catholic Church |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 02:52 pm |
|
I actually wrote this out last weekend. I needed to sort out how I had gotten where I am now, and the best way for me to do that was to write it out. It's fairly detailed in parts, but I'll be glad to answer any questions, and perhaps there will be more to the story...?!
-----
I never hated Catholicism like some Southern Baptists. My parents taught me
that many Catholic doctrines and beliefs were wrong, but that there were many
Catholic Christians, just as there were many Baptists who were not Christians.
What counted was whether one had a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. I
grew up believing that it was perhaps harder for a Catholic to be saved, but
that it was possible. I knew some of the basics of Catholic doctrine, but
inaccurately and not in any detail: I knew about papal authority, the Real
Presence, respect for saints and Mary (whether it was worship or not I didn't
know), purgatory, etc., along with all the popular stereotypes about mortal
sins, exorcisms and such that are interesting to boys. I have never had any
close relationships with practicing Catholics, and I thought that Catholic
traditions and practices such as statues, rosaries, crucifixes, and incense
were strange and a little bit creepy.
I did not know it at the time, but I suppose that my first step towards the
Church came when I discovered C.S. Lewis. I had read and loved the Narnia books
as a child, enjoying them more for the fantasy and adventure in them than their
spiritual messages (although even as a child I recognized what was happening in
The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe). In high school, though, I read Mere
Christianity. That book had a significant impact on my spiritual development,
because it revealed Christianity as something exquisitely beautiful,
awe-inspiring, and joyful, not merely true and traditional. What is more, it
opened my mind to the existence of different perspectives on several aspects
of Christianity. A key example of this is when Lewis states that all Christians
that faith, baptism, and the Eucharist are the three requirements for salvation
(explaining that different denominations place different amounts of emphasis on
each one, but that they all say you should have all three). Or when he mentions
how God can use physical symbols (such as baptism) to confer spiritual gifts
(such as salvation). As a Southern Baptist, I believed that baptism and the
Lord's Supper were merely outward symbols of inward spiritual realities. C.S.
Lewis showed me how it was reasonable to believe that these physical rituals
could be spritually significant.
However, the first event that caused me to think about the Catholic Church for
any length of time did not occur until the end of my freshman year of college.
That event was the death of Pope John Paul II. As he was near death and after
his passing, I found myself glued to the TV screen watching the crowds keeping
vigil in Vatican City. I found myself overcome by emotion, almost to the point
of tears, by the death of this man who I believed to be very holy and a great
witness to the world, but not endowed with spiritual authority by God. For some
reason, though, those images of crowds of mourners, including the best-attended
funeral in human history and the subsequent rejoicing over the election of
Benedict XVI made a profound impact of me.
The immediate consequence of those events was that they made me curious about
the Catholic Church. I was hearing terms and seeing symbols on CNN of which I
had no knowledge, so I began looking up articles about the Church on Wikipedia,
and I found what I learned about the Church's history, heirarchy, beliefs, and
traditions interesting but almost, in a sense, quaint, and they did not in any
way begin to consider the actual truth of Catholic doctrine. I remember being
very amused when I discovered that the Vatican has a website! Basically, at
this point I thought that Catholicism was cool.
That is where my journey towards the Church stopped for a little while. Over
the course of my sophomore year, I developed a great hunger for spirituality,
and so I began reading more of my favorite author, C.S. Lewis. As I read The
Screwtape Letters, The Problem of Pain, Miracles, and the Space Trilogy my view
of God just got bigger and bigger, and my faith deepened. (Do you know that
feeling of chills up your spine that you feel for an instant at a particularly
beautiful moment in a song or movie? I remember feeling that continuously as I
read the final chapter of Perelandra during Spring Break--it is a mind-blowing
picture of God's divine plan and one of the most beautiful passages I have ever
read.) In general, I became interested in theology.
Which leads me to my junior year, when things began to move again. Early on
that year, the scandal of Christian disunity became apparent to me. I realized
that if Christians came together and cooperated, we could accomplish far more
than we ever imagined and would force the world to take notice. Basically, I
was praying "that all of them may be one", that "they may be brought to
complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them"
(John 17:21,23). I recognized that all Christians agreed on the key points and
believed that the failure of denominations and individual churches to work
towards cooperation on evangelization and social issues was a result of
inflating the importance of minor doctrinal disputes, pride, emotional
barriers, and laziness. I came to fully grasp a truth that I had been taught in
Sunday School but never fully understood: that the Church is not made of brick and
mortar, it is made of people, that each Christian is a cell of Christ's Body.
Furthermore, I recognized that Jesus founded only one Church, that in truth it
is incorrect to speak of "a church", but only of "the Church". I yearned for
greater unity and cooperation among the divided members of that single Body.
That conviction was in part prompted and encouraged by the previous summer,
where I had worked at an ecumenical youth camp called PASSPORT. I had attended
M-Fuge camps as a youth, which had a profound impact on my spiritual life, but
were only attended by Southern Baptist churches. I liked PASSPORT because it
was intentionally ecumenical, and so I ministered to youth from Baptist,
Presbyterian, Methodist, Lutheran, and Episcopal churches. However, almost all
of these churches (and the staff) had liberal views. This meant that while in
my ideal world of Christian unity, I imagined myself paying no notice of
minor differences in theology between different denominations, but in real life
it was a little bit harder for me to do. Indeed, some of the churches (and
staffers) believed things that made me question whether they deserved to be
called Christian. In short, my experience with PASSPORT over two summers and
my junior year of college awakened my heartfelt desire for Christian unity, but
made me question whether it could be achieved by merely ignoring or glossing
over our doctrinal differences.
My casual curiosity with Catholicism continued during this period, and I
suppose the next development came when I discovered the Catechism on the
Vatican website. I was struck not only with the beautiful way in which the
Catechism expressed the Catholic faith (I remember thinking that the Baptist
Faith and Message couldn't hold a candle to it) but with how much of it I
agreed with. Of course I paid little heed to statements about the pope and
Mary, but I enjoyed reading its eloquent summaries of Christian teaching on
most other issues. Eventually, I got tired of reading online and bought a copy
of the Catechism which I kept carefully hidden from my friends and family.
At about the same time, my growing interest in theology and apologetics led me
to discover sites for organizations like the Veritas Forum (http://www.veritas.org) which contained audio files of lectures on a variety of topics relating to apologetics. I began
listening to these talks by figures such as William Lane Craig and J.P.
Moreland when I went to bed at night. Eventually, I stumbled across one by a
philosophy professor named Peter Kreeft. I don't remember what it was about,
but I was so impressed by it that I searched online for more about him and
discovered his website (http://www.peterkreeft.com) which contained a number of audio recordings of talks and lectures he had given. I immediately fell in love with Dr. Kreeft because his style, logic, and wisdom reminded me of C.S. Lewis, whom Dr. Kreeft himself greatly respected.
I quickly learned from his talks that Dr. Kreeft had been raised Calvinist but
had converted to Catholicism. This was the first time I had heard anyone make
an argument for the truth of the Catholic Church over Protestantism, and I was
interested. He told the story of being told by a professor that the Catholic
Church was like Noah's Ark to which a number of foreign and pagan barnacles had
grown attached, and that the Reformation scaped off the barnacles and returned
the Church to the pure state it was in at the beginning of its history. This
brought him to realize that he could discover whether or not Protestantism was
correct by seeing if the early church was Protestant or not. When he did the
research, he realized that they were definitely not Protestant, and so he
joined the Catholic Church. I knew practically nothing about church history; as
far as my church was continued, things seemed to jump directly from the end of
Acts to the 1990s, with perhaps a brief stop in the 1500s. However, I suspected
that Dr. Kreeft was right: I had already discovered and started reciting the
Nicene Creed, and I knew that what the bishops in the 4th century meant by "one holy catholic and apostolic Church" was different than how I interpreted those words.
I continued to read and listen to Dr. Kreeft online, but I did not follow him
in investigating the early church. I suspected that if I did, I would find a
very Catholic picture, and I did not know what to do with that. I left it to
the side for the moment. However, by this point I no longer viewed Catholicism
as inferior to Protestantism. I had great respect for Catholicism and was
beginning to recognize that a solid argument could be made for it against
Protestantism. The ball had begun to roll downhill, and now it began to gain
momentum. I had already come to see Catholicism as "cool", and now I had
reached the point where I almost wanted to be Catholic.
After another summer spent working for PASSPORT, I returned to school for the
fall semester of my senior year. Just as last year I had been impressed with a
desire for Christian unity, this year I was impressed with the need for my
faith to be made manifest in my works. I asked myself if I said I believed one
thing but did the opposite, did I really believe it? I read the passage in
Matthew 25 about the sheep and the goats which C.S. Lewis bluntly called
"terrifying". I read the second chapter of James, where James writes, "You see
that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone" (James
2:24), flatly contradicting the Protestant doctrine of "sola fide". I began to
realize that there is not really much difference between Protestantism and
Catholicism on the doctrine of salvation, just a difference of terminology and
emphasis. In any case, both agreed that genuine faith will be followed and
manifested by good works, which convicted me.
My growing interest in Catholicism also led me to several Catholic websites,
including one which included an archive of audio files from "The Journey Home"
and Catholic Answers. I was astounded to discover that there were literally
thousands of other Christians who had begun asking the same questions I had and
had found the answers in the Catholic Church. By listening to these programs,
I gained a clearer picture of actual Catholic doctrine and was also made aware
of many other problems with Protestantism, such as sola scriptura (which I had
had questions about even while firmly Baptist) and the source of authority. I
heard several recommendations for books such as Rome Sweet Home and Crossing
the Tiber on these programs, and I eventually decided to look for them. One
December day near the end of the fall semester, I drove to the two large
bookstores in town looking to buy one of the books I had heard mentioned.
However, neither of them had any that I was interested in.
As I have reflected on these events, I have become ever more aware of the Holy
Spirit's presence and guidance throughout the process. Just now, I am
recognizing one more way in which God has brought things together. Not long
before my trip to the bookstores, I saw a bumper sticker on a minivan in front
of me for a Christian radio station. Expecting a cheesy Christian music station like
the one in my hometown, I was surprised to find a Catholic radio station! I added
it to my presets, and while I was driving between bookstores I heard a
commercial for a Catholic bookstore. After coming up empty at both of the big bookstores, I decided to try the Catholic bookstore. I made a guess
as to what road I thought the commercial had said it was on, looked up the
road on my map, discovered it was on my way home, and found it (much to my amazement). I got nervous when I saw statues of Mary in the window, and actually got back into my car. I was honestly somewhat scared to go inside: I realized that I was about to step into a culture utterly foreign to me. Eventually, after going back and forth in my head several times and seeing someone else go in (so I knew I would not be the only one inside) I went in. It was mostly full of statues, necklaces, and
school uniforms, but in the back corner I did find a few shelves of books. I decided to buy a book which I had heard mentioned and which would allow me to begin my study of the early church: Four Witnesses, by Rod Bennett. As soon as I opened it, I was hooked.
Bennett's book is essentially a compilation of important passages from the
works of four of the earliest Church Fathers: Clement of Rome, Ignatius of
Antioch, Justin Martyr, and Irenaeus of Lyons. However, Bennett surrounds the
quotations with captivating descriptions of the lives of the writers and the
contexts in which they were writing. I found his descriptions of Clement being
taught by Peter and Paul, Ignatius bravely facing the lions in the Colisseum,
Justin defending Christianity to the emperor, and Irenaeus combating the heresy
of Gnosticism as gripping as anything by John Grisham. And Dr. Kreeft was
right: these early Christians were certainly not Southern Baptist. I noticed
Ignatius's constant exhortations to submit to the authority of the bishops,
priests, and deacons. I also noticed that certain aspects of the Gnostic and Docetist heresies which many of the early Fathers spent much time combating were eerily similar to some aspects of my Baptist understanding, such as the implicit belief that
physical matter has little value. One passage, however, bowled me over. When I
read this passage from Justin Martyr, my dwindling confidence in Protestantism
took a big hit:
"For we do not receive these things as common bread or common drink; but in
like manner as Jesus Christ our Savior having been incarnate by God's logos
took both flesh and blood for our salvation, so also we have been taught that
the food eucharistized through the word of prayer that is from Him, from which
our blood and flesh are nourished by transformation, is the flesh and blood of
that Jesus who became incarnate."
Equally powerful was Rod Bennett's commentary immediately following, which
helped to clear up the confusing concept (for me) of the Mass as a sacrifice:
"No, the Lord's Supper does not constitute another sacrifice... because the
Church believed it to be the same sacrifice: Jesus' actual Body and Blood,
broken and spilled on Calvary, really made present on her altars until He comes
again. Not broken and spilled again, mind you, but once for all--yet
communicated forever to the individual believer by means of a sacred memorial
meal. Just as the ancient Hebrew Passover was not considered complete until
everyone had actually eaten the Lamb, so Justin and the early Christians took
the Lord's words to Peter literally" (pg. 194)
With that new and surprising picture of the early church fresh in my mind, I
went home for Christmas break and spent it secretly buying and reading more
Catholic books. The first book I got was a collection of letters between a
Catholic priest and an anti-Catholic evangelical. While I do not think the
priest always gave the best arguments, I was constantly struck by the way he
presented Catholic concepts in terms of a family. Whereas Protestant metaphors
tend to be more judicial or economic in nature (Jesus "paid the price" for our
sin), Catholic metaphors are almost always familial (parent, spouse, child),
which seems to me to be a much more accurate (and beautiful) way to
understand the way God relates to us. After all, He is our Father and we are His
children, as well as the Body and Bride of Christ.
Before returning to school, I purchased Catholic Christianity, a sort of
summary and commentary on the official Catechism by Peter Kreeft. It
essentially summarizes the Catechism in easy-to-understand language, with Dr.
Kreeft's wonderful images and arguments to support them.
At this point, I suppose I am about 3/4 Catholic. I not only think Catholicism
is "cool", I sincerely want to be Catholic, but more than that I want to know
the truth. I believe that a strong, consistent argument can be made for
practically every aspect of Catholic belief. Not necessarily a logically
compelling argument, but an argument that is at least as reasonable as those in
support of Protestantism. However, I still do not know any practicing Catholics
in my daily life, and I do not have many people that I can talk openly with
about these issues. I believe that the next step in my decision is for me to
experience first-hand the doctrines I have been reading about. I need to attend
Mass and find out what Catholicism is like when it is really lived out. I
suspect that at that point, I will have to make some sort of final decision
about where to go. Right now, I cannot comfortably call myself a Baptist, but
neither can I call myself a Catholic; I am just a confused and wandering
Christian.
To borrow C.S. Lewis's picture from the Preface to Mere Christianity, I have
left the Baptist room and am out in the hallway. I am examining the Catholic
door, and am very excited by what I see. But I do not yet have the courage and
the conviction to open it. God, lead me to your truth. Lead me to the Church
that holds your teaching. Because you said, "If you hold to my teaching, you
are really my disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set
you free" (John 8:31-32).
____________________
"Almost the whole of Christian theology could perhaps be deduced from the two facts: (a) That men make coarse jokes, and (b) That they feel the dead to be uncanny."
- C.S. Lewis, Miracles
|
|
|
EMarshallBuckles
Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 19th, 2007 |
| Location: | Rockville (Near Richmond), Virginia USA |
| Posts: | 524 |
| First Name: | Marshall | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Christian Church,Episcopal Church,Baptist denomination,learning about RCC |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 03:52 pm |
|
Looks like we have a lot in common, ha, ha! Yes, I too, have "ventured out into the hallway", so to speak. I "leave the Catholic doors wide open" that the Catholic Church may actually be the one true church. I do think that God uses other "mainstream" (Baptist, Christian Church, Methodist, Anglican/Episcopalian, Presbyterian, etc.) denominations to help "round up the stray sheep", so to speak, and that these people are Christians too. As it happens, I have a twin brother who is a Roman Catholic while I became a Baptist some years ago. Ironically, the local Baptist Church I joined (in another city, I am a member of another one now) would NOT accept my Christian Church (the church of my childhood) baptism while the Catholic Church DID accept my brother's Christian Church baptism. Anyway, I have been enjoying "wading in the waters of the Tiber" , so to speak, and find much to enjoy and respect about the Catholic Church. It is an awesome church! By the way, if you have access to it via television, the Eternal Word Television Network (EWTN) provides some excellent programming (as you may already know if you can get it) about Catholic matters. I especially enjoy watching the Daily Mass. Take care! See ya in the "hall way", ha, ha! 
|
|
|
Credo Catholic
Member
| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Greenville, South Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 1212 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 04:34 pm |
|
| Faramir, that's a powerful account of your journey as you searched for the true church of Christ. I appreciate the time it took for you to tell it, and I look forward to hearing more of your journey!
|
|
|
Dave Armstrong
Network Apologist
| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1227 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Nominal Methodist / evangelical non-denom / "Bapticostal" / Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 08:30 pm |
|
| Thanks for sharing, Steven. That's a lot of great reading you've been doing. You may have already gone too far to ever go back to where you were. As you continue your spiritual searching, we'll be here to help you in any way we can, without forcing you to move ahead more quickly than you feel comfortable with.
____________________
I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 1900+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
|
|
|
brian
Member
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Chicago South Burbs, Illinois USA |
| Posts: | 720 |
| First Name: | brian | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | methodist, evangelical, anglican, catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2008 03:51 am |
|
This is exciting. And sounds familiar to some things I experienced. Keep searching. And do not be afraid of Mary. She is such a help in drawing us closer to the heart of Christ, and not a competitor. Plus, we are not expected to just get it all overnight. Some things that seemed difficult or uncomfortable for me at first, I think God sort of eased me into little bits at a time. The important thing is to be where you are, which is wanting to know the truth. Seeking, not running away, yet not trying to do too much at once.
I suggest trying a few churches and seeing what you find. I love how diverse, yet universal and united the church is. I go to an Eastern Rite church.
But try to learn to to love the liturgy for what it is in and of itself even if you are at churches where it is not prayed very enthusiastically or with music you like etc. It is truth that counts, and the mass is the worship of heaven, but sometimes we fail to enter into it. But what is going on is miraculous and lifechanging. Sometiems it can be tough depending on where you live to find other practicing Catholics. I find because there are more of us that there is more of everything. More saints, but more people who are also just tthere to be there. But the good thing is that all are welcome and sometimes people who I would have thoguht were far from God or being "saved" when I was more evangelical, I realized I should not judge and that the Catholic faith may mean more to them than you realize.
Going to a weekday mass is a great way to see groups of people very dedicated to the church. Attendance may be smaller in some parishes than others, and most of the atttendees may be older than you but what other church has church every day and thousands of people who would go.
Brian
here is where you can read about my journey.
http://www.brianbrianbrian.blogspot.com
|
|
|
tedjenczewski
Member
| Joined: | Thu May 10th, 2007 |
| Location: | Richmond, Virginia USA |
| Posts: | 162 |
| First Name: | Ted | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, Presbyterian, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 03:45 am |
|
| Welcome Steven, After reading about your journey and desire to search for truth, I think you just HAVE TO download "A Biblical Defense of Catholicism" from Dave Armstrong's website. The site is listed at the bottom of his post above, and the book only costs $5.00. It presents some pretty convincing Catholic apologetics. Then check out some of Scott Hahn's books like "The Lambs Supper" or "Letter and Spirit" available at CHN Resources. These books describe the tradition and history of the divine liturgy. God bless you.
____________________
"...the church of the living God, the pillar and bulwark of the truth." 1Tim 3, 15
|
|
|
trebori2
Member
| Joined: | Fri May 16th, 2008 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 3 |
| First Name: | trebor | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Sat May 17th, 2008 01:43 am |
|
POWERFUL!!!
HELPS ME UNDERSTAND WHERE MY FELLOW CHRISTIANS ARE COMING FROM.
THE SPIRIT WILL GUIDE YOU.
PEACE
|
|
|
Current time is 06:34 am | |
|
|
|
|
|
