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miles Dei
Member
| Joined: | Mon Apr 30th, 2007 |
| Location: | Massachusetts USA |
| Posts: | 11 |
| First Name: | miles | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Cradle Catholic, currently experiencing "faith moratorium" |
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Posted: Wed May 2nd, 2007 08:28 pm |
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Good afternoon everyone. I've got a few questions about two passages of Scripture that have stood out to me in particular these last few weeks, and I've wrestled over what exactly they might mean and how they correlate.
The first passage: In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes:
"Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit." (NIV)
The second passage: In Matthew 7:21, Matthew writes:
"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven." (NIV)
Question 1: If what Paul is saying in Corinthians is true, then how could any Protestant make the claim that the Holy Spirit is not within the Catholic Church? Call me crazy, but isn't the claim that "Jesus is Lord" central to the Mass and all of Catholicism in general?
Question 2: What Jesus is saying in Matthew's Gospel seems (to me, at least) to be a pretty strong endorsement of faith living in works. Here Jesus clearly says that he wants us to do his Father's will on Earth, and warns against hypocrites who falsely claim to be one of His disciples by neglecting to do so. What do you think?
Question 3: Given the context of these two passages, it must be so that in order to be truly "saved" one must both (1.) call Jesus Lord (and mean it... duh) and (2.) do his Father's will on Earth. I.e., service to the Father results as a fruit of one's faith and devotion. Isn't that the whole idea of "faith working through love" that we Catholics espouse?
I apologize if I seem robotic in presenting my thoughts so numerically, it's just how I've been "programmed" to think  . Thanks so much for any help or clarification you can offer me.
(PS: You'll be seeing much more of me around the Scripture forum in the next few weeks ^_^)
God love,
miles
____________________
There's only one true path in life,
The road that leads to All leads to One,
There's only one true path in life,
The road that leads to our Vision.
-Serj Tankian
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japhy
Member
| Joined: | Thu Apr 26th, 2007 |
| Location: | Princeton, New Jersey USA |
| Posts: | 229 |
| First Name: | Jeff | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic (Roman Rite) |
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Posted: Wed May 2nd, 2007 09:21 pm |
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miles Dei wrote: In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes: "Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit." (NIV)
In Matthew 7:21, Matthew writes: "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven." (NIV)
Question 1: If what Paul is saying in Corinthians is true, then how could any Protestant make the claim that the Holy Spirit is not within the Catholic Church? Call me crazy, but isn't the claim that "Jesus is Lord" central to the Mass and all of Catholicism in general?
Question 2: What Jesus is saying in Matthew's Gospel seems (to me, at least) to be a pretty strong endorsement of faith living in works. Here Jesus clearly says that he wants us to do his Father's will on Earth, and warns against hypocrites who falsely claim to be one of His disciples by neglecting to do so. What do you think?
Question 3: Given the context of these two passages, it must be so that in order to be truly "saved" one must both (1.) call Jesus Lord (and mean it... duh) and (2.) do his Father's will on Earth. I.e., service to the Father results as a fruit of one's faith and devotion. Isn't that the whole idea of "faith working through love" that we Catholics espouse?
As for question 1, I think Scripture would agree that Protestants are not speaking in the Spirit when they call Catholicism all manner of evil things (paganism, anti-Christism, etc.). In other words, it is possible for a Christian to say something of his own will and not of the Spirit of God. Nathan the prophet had this same problem in 2 Samuel 7:1-17. David told Nathan he felt bad that he lived in a house while the Ark of God dwelt in a tent. Nathan (without seeking guidance from the Lord) said "Go, do all that is in your heart; for the LORD is with you." But then God did speak to Nathan, and told him he'd gotten it wrong. If prophets of the Lord Most High can slip up, so can Catholics and any other Christians.
Regarding question 2, yes, Jesus, Paul, James, and even Peter all attest to good works in the name of Jesus Christ as being both prerequisites to eternal life as well as the reason God made us. In the latter half of Matthew 25, Jesus talks about the sheep and the goats, those who did the will of the Father (by doing "corporal acts of mercy" such as feeding the hungry, visiting the ill, clothing the naked, etc.) contrasted with those who did not do such things. In other words, it's one thing to say you're a Christian, it's another to be a Christian. Believing in Jesus is the Christ is something even the demons do (cf. James 2:19); faith that saves is faith that is manifest in good works, the fruits of the Spirit.
And for question 3, yes. See the "Faith vs Works" thread ( http://www.chnetwork.org/forums/forum15/1424.html ) for more on that matter.
____________________
[Mary said,] "Do whatever he tells you." - John 2:5
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