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JillD
Member
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 679 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
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Posted: Wed Jun 13th, 2007 10:38 am |
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Let me clarify...
One of the things I'm loving about being a Catholic is that I no longer feel obligated to give my input into what I would consider fairly big decisions about the Church. Here's an example. When I was in the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod, I remember a discussion brewing about whether or how to change the creeds so that they would no longer say "man" or "men" but, what, "human beings"? "Human persons"? (Personally, I had no problem with them remaining man, but whatever...) It seemed that the LC-MS solicited input from the laity in making the decision, and, naturally, this created quite a brouhaha with the older folks wanting it to stay "man" and the younger, 'enlightened' folks preferring the gender neutral. Yuck.
Is there anything like this in the Catholic Church? I HOPE NOT! I know that the men at the top are not perfect, but I also know that God is in control of this Church and that, whatever comes, even if for a time it's sinful, ultimately God will have His way.
For what sorts of things, if any, does the Magisterium consider the thoughts or wishes of the laity when making decisions?
Jill
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"I praise you, for I am wondrously made. Wonderful are our works! You know me right well; my frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately wrought in the depths of the earth." Psalm 139
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JillD
Member
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 679 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
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Posted: Wed Jun 13th, 2007 10:52 am |
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How funny! Right after posting this question, I started on my daily website routine, one of which is California Catholic Daily - http://www.calcatholic.com/ - where the lead article today begins with this paragraph:
"More than 300 participants gathered for the Northern California Lay Convocation at San Francisco’s St. Mary’s Cathedral on June 2. According to the archdiocesan newspaper Catholic San Francisco, they discussed several issues, including adult catechesis, cultural diversity, ecumenism, and the role of women in the Church."
How widespread is this practice and how much influence does a "Lay Convocation" have?? You might want to read the whole article. I bet the 'convocation' was not fun.
'Time to go stick my head in the sand...
Jill
____________________
"I praise you, for I am wondrously made. Wonderful are our works! You know me right well; my frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately wrought in the depths of the earth." Psalm 139
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5085 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Wed Jun 13th, 2007 11:09 am |
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JillD wrote: Is there anything like this in the Catholic Church? I HOPE NOT! I know that the men at the top are not perfect, but I also know that God is in control of this Church and that, whatever comes, even if for a time it's sinful, ultimately God will have His way.
The Church isn't a democracy. This article says it much better than I can.
Briefly, the laity is consulted in some matters. Their wishes come to the Holy Father through the bishops in synods, and especially during their ad limina visits. During an ad limina visit, the bishop of a diocese meets privately with the pope and gives a report on the state of his diocese. A former bishop told us once that the pope had asked him specific questions about specific parishes, priests, pastoral assignments, etc., which indicated he had done his research. An example of when the laity might be consulted would include whether the diocesan catechetical program is effective, whether regulations regarding RCIA are being followed, whether liturgical abuses are occurring, etc.
On matters of faith and morals, the laity is not consulted at all. There is no vote to determine, for example, whether women should be ordained to the priesthood. Bishops have a say in some matters, as they are the successors to the apostles. Doctrinal matters are decided in part by the wishes of the people, because the Holy Spirit moves in the Church. One of the reasons the Immaculate Conception was declared dogma was that it was a publicly held belief for centuries, but the belief was also backed by Scripture, Tradition, and the constant teaching of the Magisterium.
So yes, public input from the laity is sought but no, there is no popular vote to determine doctrine as in many other Christian communities.
As for events like the "lay convocation" you mention, it has no authority at all. The bishop may choose advisory bodies as he sees fit, and such convocations are important to give him feedback on such things as the role of women in a diocese, but the convocation will not produce any decisions. The general consensus may indicate a problem the diocese needs to address, such as that women hold lower level positions but positions of authority are male-dominated, or that the diocese is doing a poor job of responding to the sex abuse problem. There is also a diocesan pastoral council and a priests' council that meet to offer advice to the bishop, but they have only the power he gives them. The decisions are his. National bishops conferences can do only what the Church allows them to do, and Vatican congregations are only permitted what is permitted by the pope. Ultimately he approves virtually everything either personally or through his designee. (Cardinal Ratzinger often spoke for John Paul II.)
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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