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hpj0828
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| Joined: | Sun Apr 1st, 2007 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 140 |
| First Name: | Henry | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Messianic Jewish believer |
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Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 11:37 am |
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In 1983, I was unfortunately in a life-threatening situation. At that time, I didn't know very much about the Holy Spirit, but I knew that He was supposed to help people in times of great need. I recall very vividly, as though it were today, how I cried out to the Holy Spirit at that time to help me-now!
No sooner had I uttered this prayer than I received a powerful filling of the Holy Spirit. I felt a profound divine love for my attacker that welled up within me from my feet to the top of my head. The Holy Spirit took control of my mouth. I didn't speak in tongues, but in English. What came out were words of wisdom I could never have imagined thinking on my own. As a result, the situation was defused. I felt like one of those NYC cops that knows how to talk the way out of a hostage situation. I was clear that these words did not come from my mind, but rather appeared on my lips, much to my astonishment, as I listened to what I was saying!
Since that time, I have experienced many powerful spiritual gifts and prophetic visions.
I am taking RCIA class. They tell me that when I receive confirmation, I will receive the Holy Spirit?
It seems like I have already received him! Or else I would not be here today writing this post.
What is the connection between confirmation and the receiving of the Holy Spirit? 
Henry
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HPJ
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japhy
Member
| Joined: | Thu Apr 26th, 2007 |
| Location: | Princeton, New Jersey USA |
| Posts: | 180 |
| First Name: | Jeff (you can call me "japhy" | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic (Latin Rite) |
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Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 01:33 pm |
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There is a difference between "happening upon grace" and "having a positive disposition for grace". I think a good Scriptural example is Numbers 22-24 juxtaposed with Numbers 31:8. Balaam, a pagan, was "hired" by God (so to speak) to proclaim a message to Balak. However, Balaam remained a pagan thereafter and was killed by Israel during the war with the Midianites. Balaam, as a soothsayer or diviner, "happened upon grace" by being used by God to speak true and proper prophecies (including Num 24:17 which prophesies the Star of Bethlehem)... but this never effected a change in him to give up his wickedness and turn away from false gods and serve only the True God: he never received an indelible mark that would provide "a positive disposition for grace".
The sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation, and Holy Orders place an indelible mark upon your soul: this is called a "sacramental character". Here are some excerpts from the CCC related to Confirmation and its character:
698 The seal is a symbol close to that of anointing. "The Father has set his seal" on Christ and also seals us in him. Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation, and Holy Orders, the image of the seal (sphragis) has been used in some theological traditions to express the indelible "character" imprinted by these three unrepeatable sacraments.
1121 The three sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation, and Holy Orders confer, in addition to grace, a sacramental character or "seal" by which the Christian shares in Christ's priesthood and is made a member of the Church according to different states and functions. This configuration to Christ and to the Church, brought about by the Spirit, is indelible, it remains for ever in the Christian as a positive disposition for grace, a promise and guarantee of divine protection, and as a vocation to divine worship and to the service of the Church. Therefore these sacraments can never be repeated.
1304 Like Baptism which it completes, Confirmation is given only once, for it too imprints on the soul an indelible spiritual mark, the "character," which is the sign that Jesus Christ has marked a Christian with the seal of his Spirit by clothing him with power from on high so that he may be his witness.
1317 Confirmation, like Baptism, imprints a spiritual mark or indelible character on the Christian's soul; for this reason one can receive this sacrament only once in one's life.
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[Mary said,] "Do whatever he tells you." - John 2:5
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5080 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 03:07 pm |
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hpj0828 wrote: They tell me that when I receive confirmation, I will receive the Holy Spirit?
It seems like I have already received him! Or else I would not be here today writing this post.
We receive the Holy Spirit many times in many ways. It is the Spririt, the "Lord and Giver of Life", who infuses God's presence into us at our conception. We are anointed at baptism with the oil of Chrism and baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Spirit. We receive the Spirit at every moment as God's grace living within us. We receive the Spirit in a unique and special way at our Confirmation. And the Church calls on the healing Spirit in the Anointing of the Sick.
Remember that the apostles were certainly spirit-filled, and yet Jesus breathed on them and said "receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven; whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." They also received the Spirit in the Upper Room on Pentecost.
But the Church offers us the Spirit through the sacraments, as Japhy said, that impart an indelible character upon us: Baptism, Confirmation, and Holy Orders. And yet, as you say, if we did not already possess the Spirit within us, we could not even approach the sacraments!
It's one of those "Catholic" things: It's a Mystery!
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Ken Follis
Member
| Joined: | Thu Oct 25th, 2007 |
| Location: | San Antonio, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 40 |
| First Name: | Ken | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Charismatic Episcopal Church; Roman Catholic Church (1999) |
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Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 07:27 pm |
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There is a book written about this, called "Christian Initiation and the Baptism of the Holy Spirit" by Fr. George Montague, a Catholic priest.
The Holy Spirit filled the same believers more than once, according to St Luke in the Book of Acts. For us today as well, the Holy Spirit is in every Sacramental act and each day, as a result, we are to walk in the Spirit as St. Paul instructs. There have been moments in history when the Holy Spirit manifested either in the life of individuals (namely the Saints) or in group settings. However, be aware that not everything that folks attribute to the Holy Spirit is fact. Some things are just products of an active imagination. Much that is passed off as the actions of the Spirit is really the worked up emotionalism due to the release of endorphins in the brain, altered states of consciousness, manipulation, psycho-semantics and the power of suggestion.
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Jer. 6:16 "Stand, Look, Ask and Walk!"
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Pani Rose
Member
| Joined: | Fri Oct 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Irondale, Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 390 |
| First Name: | Rose | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Ruthenian Byzantine in a Melkite Greek Catholic Parish, raised ... |
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Posted: Sun Oct 28th, 2007 08:51 pm |
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I received a pm from someone on another forum one day. Had no idea of who he was. Well what he shared was amazing in many ways.
He asked if I went to St. Georges in Birmingham AL., and I told him yes.
He then went on to share, how as a homeless person, he had traveled across the US and had visited the Greek Orthodox, Marionite Churches in our town along with St. George which is Melkite.
This particular Sunday there was a Baptism. This is actually a Baptism in our Church http://www.melkite.org/Baptism.html - we do full emersion, adult and baby. The baby girl was fussing to no end. After the exorcism, and the preparation of the water, Fr. Frank took her in his arms and as soon as she was emersed in the water she became quite. Then, she received Chrismation, once dressed as soon as she was in Fr. Franks arms - she fell fast asleep and never made another sound. This man shared how she was so peaceful then. Afterwards, everyone went downstairs for dinner and of course he was invited to share the meal.
It made such an impact on his life - the experience of seeing that child of God receive Baptism, Chrismation ( the Holy Spirit) and Eucharist - that he is no longer homeless. He has an apartment in CA some place, and was received into the Catholic Church.
We are all called to walk in the power of the Holy Spirit - as we are clay pots, we leak - so we must be filled over and over again. But, our Lord calls us to the fullness of faith - walking in the power of the Triune God, through his Sacramental Church. Then we know for sure we are walking with God's awesome and lifegivng Holy Spirit.
We have been part of the Charismatic Renewal in the Roman Catholic Church since 1979. So we really understand the necessity to keep the gifts of the Holy Spirit in agreement with the teachings of the Catholic Church.
Last edited on Sun Oct 28th, 2007 08:55 pm by Pani Rose
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