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JillD
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 600 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
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Posted: Wed Jan 17th, 2007 02:07 am |
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| At our RCIA class tonight, I'm pretty sure I understood the teacher to say that unless my marriage is blessed in the Catholic Church, I'm living in adultery with my husband. We had a non-Christian, though civilly legal, wedding ceremony and our marriage was blessed later in the Lutheran Church. Now I am in the process of converting, but my husband is not. As I understood this gal tonight, she was saying that I am fornicating because my marriage is not valid in the Catholic Church. Can this be correct?????
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"The alternative to obedience is to turn the conversation into a cacophony of Christians making it up as they go along." - Fr. Richard John Neuhaus
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DrDave
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| Joined: | Mon Nov 6th, 2006 |
| Location: | Mildura, Australia |
| Posts: | 211 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Cradle - Lapsed - Renewed Catholic |
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Posted: Wed Jan 17th, 2007 02:22 am |
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The short answer (as I understand it, I'm sure Rick will confirm)is that if neither of you have ever been Catholic and neither of you have ever been married before then any marriage that took place before either of you became Catholic is presumed to be a valid sacramental marriage by the church.
If, however, either of you were ever catholic or ever married before then it starts to get complicated, in which case you would need to provide a bit more detail for a solid answer.
Regards Dave
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 4981 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Wed Jan 17th, 2007 02:25 am |
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JillD wrote: [size=At our RCIA class tonight, I'm pretty sure I understood the teacher to say that unless my marriage is blessed in the Catholic Church, I'm living in adultery with my husband. We had a non-Christian, though civilly legal, wedding ceremony and our marriage was blessed later in the Lutheran Church. Now I am in the process of converting, but my husband is not. As I understood this gal tonight, she was saying that I am fornicating because my marriage is not valid in the Catholic Church. Can this be correct?????]
No, it is not correct. Had either of you been baptized Catholics, that would be technically correct provided you had a full understanding of the Church's marriage regulations. However, neither God nor God's Church holds you responsible for what you don't know. For a sin to be mortal, it must be a grave matter that you commit knowingly and willingly.
Those who are not Catholic are not bound by the marriage laws of the Church. Provided that neither of you was Catholic and neither was married before, your marriage is recognized by the Church and should not even need to be validated ("blessed"). Two baptized Christians contract a sacramental marriage with each other as long as they follow the marriage regulations of their own church at the time of the marriage. The fact that it was blessed in a Lutheran church is irrelevant.
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Darlene
Member
| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 877 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Fri Jan 19th, 2007 07:26 pm |
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Jill, I'm so glad you brought this up. I've been a bit worried about this lately and have not wanted to bring it up to anyone in the local parish.
Rick, I'm so glad you explained everything. Neither my husband or myself were ever Catholic so I don't have to stress about this. I was thinking that I would never be able to accept the Eucharist if I became Catholic because my husband and I were not married in the Catholic Church. What you have said has been such a relief for me. Thank You.
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The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 4981 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Fri Jan 19th, 2007 07:36 pm |
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Darlene wrote: Neither my husband or myself were ever Catholic so I don't have to stress about this.
As long as you are both in your first and only marriage, this is not a factor for you at all.
Having said that, let me also say that I often recommend a renewal of vows before a Catholic priest. In joining the Catholic Church you accept a new name in confirmation representing your new life of faith. Renewing your vows in the Church recommits you to honoring your vows before God and his Church. It is not necessary but adds a new dimension to the commitment you have for each other. It's like a new beginning.
This is not the same as validation for a marriage that is not recognized by the Church, although the ceremony is very similar. No record is kept, and usually no certificate is given. It is a re-commitment between the two partners who now know that their marriage is a sacramental union blessed by God. It gets things off to a new start as part of his/her/their new life of faith. It recognizes that the new life of faith applies not only individually but to the two who have become one.
And it can be beautiful and quite meaningful. As one lady told me after she and her daughter had joined the Church, her husband returned, and their marriage was validated, for the first time in her life she felt like her marriage belonged to God, too. (For them, it was necessary; it is no less beautiful and meaningful when it is not required.)
Last edited on Fri Jan 19th, 2007 07:49 pm by CajunRick
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Darlene
Member
| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 877 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Sat Jan 20th, 2007 04:38 pm |
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cajunrick wrote:
As long as you are both in your first and only marriage, this is not a factor for you at all.
Neither of us have ever been married before. We made an agreement when we were first married that we would never mention the "d" word as a solution to a problem we were having. I think a few months ago my husband spoke in haste, without thinking, when he said we would have to separate if I became Catholic. Before that, and since then, he has never mentioned anything about divorce or separating, and neither have I.
Having said that, let me also say that I often recommend a renewal of vows before a Catholic priest. In joining the Catholic Church you accept a new name in confirmation representing your new life of faith. Renewing your vows in the Church recommits you to honoring your vows before God and his Church. It is not necessary but adds a new dimension to the commitment you have for each other. It's like a new beginning.
This is not the same as validation for a marriage that is not recognized by the Church, although the ceremony is very similar. No record is kept, and usually no certificate is given. It is a re-commitment between the two partners who now know that their marriage is a sacramental union blessed by God. It gets things off to a new start as part of his/her/their new life of faith. It recognizes that the new life of faith applies not only individually but to the two who have become one.
And it can be beautiful and quite meaningful. As one lady told me after she and her daughter had joined the Church, her husband returned, and their marriage was validated, for the first time in her life she felt like her marriage belonged to God, too. (For them, it was necessary; it is no less beautiful and meaningful when it is not required.)
I understand what you are saying here Rick, but I don't know how realistic that would be taking my circumstances into consideration. Of course, I don't know the future. Perhaps my husband will be taking RCIA classes with me in the Fall. That would be nothing short of a miracle!
Darlene
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The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 4981 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Sat Jan 20th, 2007 07:31 pm |
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Darlene wrote: cajunrick wrote: Having said that, let me also say that I often recommend a renewal of vows before a Catholic priest.
I understand what you are saying here Rick, but I don't know how realistic that would be taking my circumstances into consideration. Of course, I don't know the future. Perhaps my husband will be taking RCIA classes with me in the Fall. That would be nothing short of a miracle!
It wasn't necessarily a suggestion, really more of a "point of order" or "the rest of the story...". Sometimes a renewal of vows can be a new beginning after a contentious period of disagreement and decision over whether to join the Catholic Church, and so I do often suggest it even when it isn't required, and I just wanted to bring that out.
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Darlene
Member
| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 877 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Sat Jan 20th, 2007 08:17 pm |
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| Back in 1999, we renewed our vows at our former Reformed Baptist Church. I wore a wedding dress, had my son walk me down the aisle, and we rededicated ourselves to each other. It was just like getting married all over again. And our pastor from the Pilgrim Holiness Church resided over the ceremony!
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The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 4981 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Sat Jan 20th, 2007 08:57 pm |
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Darlene wrote: I wore a wedding dress, had my son walk me down the aisle, and we rededicated ourselves to each other. It was just like getting married all over again.
Was it the same wedding dress? Did it still fit? 
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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