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brian
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Chicago South Burbs, Illinois USA |
| Posts: | 720 |
| First Name: | brian | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | methodist, evangelical, anglican, catholic |
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Posted: Wed May 16th, 2007 11:53 pm |
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Say a friend of mine was supposes to go to church on a day of obligation. But instead invites me out for a fun road trip. I fulfill my obligation some other time. But if I tell him I am concerned if He should make this trip insteadof go to church first, but he insists that he is celebrating the occasion by making this trip and that it helps bring him closer to God, and really He does not go to church every week anyway, am I contributing to his sin by enjoying the day with him, or is he responsible entirely for his own choices? It is not as if he would have defnitely gone to the service even if I did not accompany him.
Now I think if I talked him into skipping church it would be different, but if he already made up his mind to do this and invited me, perhaps I should let he and God wory about the implications and just love the person and be the best example I can be.
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CajunRick
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 4979 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Thu May 17th, 2007 01:15 am |
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Invite him to church with you. I believe once you have done that, you have fulfilled your obligation to him. You have not contributed to his sin since you in fact gave him the opportunity to meet his obligation to the Church.
Otherwise, before we did anything with someone else on a holy day, we would have to make sure they had gone to church.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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David W. Emery
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Brownsville, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 1714 |
| First Name: | David | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic |
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Posted: Thu May 17th, 2007 01:19 am |
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According to your narrative, you stated your concern. He blew it off. It’s his sin, not yours. On the other hand, agreeing to go on the trip with him in this state might be seen by him or others as a tacit approval of his decision, and this could involve you in the sin of scandal.
In other words, even if only the two of you know about your friend’s decision, your acquiescence in accompanying him on the trip could be seen by him as speaking louder than your words, so he could then use that to further convince himself that it’s “no big thing” to miss Mass on a holy day of obligation. Involvement of other friends, of course, would aggravate the scandal.
David
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brian
Member
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Chicago South Burbs, Illinois USA |
| Posts: | 720 |
| First Name: | brian | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | methodist, evangelical, anglican, catholic |
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Posted: Thu May 17th, 2007 02:54 am |
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well I am confused. I think I should just go. I do not think he would go even if we were not going on the trip. My friend is Orthodox and it is the Ascension for him. owever, I talked with an Orthodox priest and though they expect everyone to go who is able, they do not have the same rules we do about the severity of a holy day of obligation. In other words they do not clearly state if it is a sin for them to miss the day or not or that it is a serious sin the way we look at it. I mean it is probably a sin for them, but they do not state it in the same way we do or with the same severity. Everyone is expected to go out of love, but they do not say that those who miss are in any state of grave or mortal sin or anything like that. They understand that some people can not make it, but leave it up to what each person is capable of and between their confessor.
Does this make it less a matter for me to be concerend with since I only know what these things mean for a Catholic and should just trust that it is not my business to tell a member of another body how to live? Or do I decide that regarldess of what his body says, it is a grave matter to deliberately miss a holy day and therfore I do not want to actively help him to do this?
As it is I think that this person will gain a lot from our trip.
So I did think of offering to go with him but instead I offered to wait to leave until after Divine Liturgy. I suppose if he were not going to go either way, and it is not necessarily an obligation for him in the same sense it is for me and I let him make his own decision after stating my concern, I would rather spend the day in fellowship with him than not with him if I do not think I am necessarily the reason thatis keeping him from church. I often try to encourage him to more actively participate, but he has some good reasons for feeling uncomfortable in church (i am not saying if they are valid, just that I can see why his attendance is what it is).
So I think that if he is not going regardless it is better that he spend the day with me than alone.
Brian
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David W. Emery
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
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| First Name: | David | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic |
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Posted: Thu May 17th, 2007 09:40 am |
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Ah, so now we learn that your friend is Orthodox, not Catholic. Since you used the phrase “a day of obligation,” both Rick and I were thrown off. Yes, it does make a difference if his Church does not canonically require him to attend on a holy day, because then it is not strictly a “day of obligation.”
In the Catholic Church, attendance at Mass on Sundays and holy days is a grave matter, and deliberate delinquency is a mortal sin, according to the Third Commandment, to keep holy the Lord’s day. This is why we have the obligation to encourage our confreres to go, and not make light of their refusal.
But if the obligation to worship is seen less strictly in other Churches, that is their matter. I see no question of scandal in it from your side. Go in peace.
David
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