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dale
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| Joined: | Sat Nov 10th, 2007 |
| Location: | Toronto, Ontario Canada |
| Posts: | 4 |
| First Name: | Dale | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | always Roman Catholic |
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Posted: Sat Nov 10th, 2007 08:21 pm |
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A colleague at work recently received an e-mail from her brother stating the following and she sent it to me with the header "have a question". Essentially she was asking how to respond to her brother raised as a RC and she herself is a good practising RC (single laywoman).
Subject: RE: have a question
"The Catholic hierarchy throughout its history has twisted the words of Jesus and the Gospels to fan hatred, justify bigotry and preserve the privileges of the wealthy and powerful in the countries they still control (like the Philippines and many Latin American countries. Even the countries the Church controlled in Europe were always the poorest - Ireland, Spain., Portugal. In the United States the Church hierarchy supports the Republican Party) So what your priest says does not surprise me at all. All Christ will ask you when your life is over is "What did you do in your life for the weakest and those who needed help the most". That is the message of Jesus in one sentence. And I wish Popes, Cardinals and priests would concentrate on that."
Thanks in advance,
dale (in Toronto)
Last edited on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 08:22 pm by dale
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BodRod
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 2nd, 2006 |
| Location: | Apple Valley, California USA |
| Posts: | 806 |
| First Name: | Cliff | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Raised an SDA, then Generic Christian, finally at home with ... |
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Posted: Sat Nov 10th, 2007 08:39 pm |
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I don't think the statement asks a question and therefore does not merit an answer. To me, the person who wrote it is just wanting to express a closed minded position and it won't matter what answer is given, he is only interested in his own bigoted opinion.
If any answer is given, I think it should be in the form of a question asking exactly what is his question and exactly what example is he willing do present to support his question.
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Gratias agamus Domino Deo nostro.
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dale
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| Joined: | Sat Nov 10th, 2007 |
| Location: | Toronto, Ontario Canada |
| Posts: | 4 |
| First Name: | Dale | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | always Roman Catholic |
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Posted: Sat Nov 10th, 2007 08:53 pm |
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Hmmm, that was my impression as well. I wrote a reply in an e-mail (now deleted) for her to send to her brother ... something to the effect that he was grossly misinformed in his understanding of world history and economics, let alone the true role of the Magesterium. As a member of the Canadian Catholic Bishops Organization for Development and Peace, I am aware that it is not the Catholic Church who contols the poorer third world countries, but rather the multinational corporations, ergo the need for "ethical funds" for conscientious investors!!! Not all shareholders are aware of where their investments are going and the implications for inhabitants of third world countries.
I also suggested that he read the Early Church Fathers in order to see for himself that the early church teaching (hence what Christ taught) is surprisingly similar to what our current Catholic Church teaches; i.e., the words of Christ have not been twisted by the Magesterium, but rather by some wayward "followers".
It was my conclusion that people often wilfully rationalize their "take" on our beloved Catholic Church and allege and misappropriate whatever makes them feel comfortable in order to avoid changing their ways and heeding the call of Christ Himself.
She said this helped her a lot in terms of her own peace of mind, but I was left with the gnawing suspicion that someone at CH Network could do a better job of this.
thx,
dale 
Last edited on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 08:56 pm by dale
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BodRod
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 2nd, 2006 |
| Location: | Apple Valley, California USA |
| Posts: | 806 |
| First Name: | Cliff | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Raised an SDA, then Generic Christian, finally at home with ... |
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Posted: Sat Nov 10th, 2007 09:34 pm |
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I am convinced that some people know what they need to do such as make some changes in their behavior, but they don't want to make the necessary changes so they try to defend their position by attacking the position that should instead, be the target or desired behavior. This kind of human behavior is not limited to religion. It can also be seen in student behavior, supervisor/subordinate relationships and marriage relationships.
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Gratias agamus Domino Deo nostro.
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dale
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| Joined: | Sat Nov 10th, 2007 |
| Location: | Toronto, Ontario Canada |
| Posts: | 4 |
| First Name: | Dale | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | always Roman Catholic |
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Posted: Sat Nov 10th, 2007 10:14 pm |
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Good observation -- similar perspective to what Fr. Groeschel speaks about in his book, "Spiritual Passages: The Psychology of Spiritual Development" -- haven't finished it yet.
bye for now and thanks for the help.
- dale
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mg57
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Tolland County, Connecticut USA |
| Posts: | 170 |
| First Name: | mg57 | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Infant Baptised Catholic |
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Posted: Sun Nov 11th, 2007 12:01 pm |
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Dale -
I noticed in his reply, the fellow in question tends toward not a Christian Fundamentalist frame of mind, but more of a liberal Protestant / secular mindset. If he has more than an "armchair" concern for the poor and actually devotes part of his week (and / or income) to volunteering at shelters, soup kitchens, visiting the infirm and / or prison ministry, then there's still hope ! 
Try this - http://speakingoffaith.publicradio.org/programs/faithfiredbylit/index.shtml
Right under the photos, you'll see "listen" "download" and, "podcast", - if you're able, why don't you try a download, burn a CD and send him a copy, - or, just send him a link if you think he'd be just as likely to listen to it online.
I've listened to it several times, and for him, it just may help to start to re-orient his thinking and blow away his pre-conceived ideas, plus provide a new basis for conversation.
God bless.
P.S. Has he never heard of :
Mother Teresa,
Walter Cizek, - http://www.amazon.com/God-Russia-Walter-J-Ciszek/dp/0898705746/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_i/002-9152665-9797644
Bishop Fan http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E0CE7DE123AF936A15757C0A964958260
Cardinal Thuan - http://www.amazon.com/Road-Hope-Gospel-Prison/dp/0819864730/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_b/002-9152665-9797644
Fr. Miguel Pro - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_Pro
Fr. Werenfried van Straaten - http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B07E7D9103BF933A25751C0A9659C8B63
How many thousands more would he like to see, ..... ?
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CajunRick
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5157 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Sun Nov 11th, 2007 12:46 pm |
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dale wrote: I wish Popes, Cardinals and priests would concentrate on that."
You know what, Dale? So do I. So I spent about three minutes doing some research on the Internet.
Catholic Relief Services
Caritas International
U. S. Conference of Catholic Bishops (left side, click on Social Justice Issues)
Vatican Web Site, search results for "Social Justice"
Analytical Index of the Compendium of the Social Doctrine of the Catholic Church
And finally, from Lumen Gentium (The Apostolic Constitution on the Church in the Modern World), one of the Documents of Vatican II:Never has the human race enjoyed such an abundance of wealth, resources and economic power, and yet a huge proportion of the worlds citizens are still tormented by hunger and poverty, while countless numbers suffer from total illiteracy. Never before has man had so keen an understanding of freedom, yet at the same time new forms of social and psychological slavery make their appearance. Although the world of today has a very vivid awareness of its unity and of how one man depends on another in needful solidarity, it is most grievously turn into opposing camps by conflicting forces. For political, social, economic, racial and ideological disputes still continue bitterly, and with them the peril of a war which would reduce everything to ashes. True, there is a growing exchange of ideas, but the very words by which key concepts are expressed take on quite different meanings in diverse ideological systems. Finally, man painstakingly searches for a better world, without a corresponding spiritual advancement. (LG4)
If I had given more than a few minutes, I could have found literally thousands more entries on such things as religious orders that provide for the poor (Mother Teresa comes to mind), organizations not sponsored by the Church that are funded and controlled by committed Catholics carrying out the Church's social justice ministry (Food for the Poor), and many, many more. My own pilgimage to Haiti is recounted at my Retreat into Reality web site, and my little country parish raised $175,000 to build a school in a remote mountain village there. The social justice ministry is alive and well in the Catholic Church.
The Church's Social Justice record is clear, and she has indeed "put her money where her mouth is". Unfortunately, we do not hear the social justice message from the pulpit very often at all, and that is a shame.
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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David W. Emery
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Brownsville, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 1861 |
| First Name: | David | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic |
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Posted: Sun Nov 11th, 2007 01:41 pm |
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You know, Dale, when my sister a few years ago voiced the same opinion as your collegue’s brother, I did exactly the same thing as mg57 and Rick have done in this thread: produced an overwhelming quantity of evidence that the Catholic Church not only cares about the poor, but cares for the poor far more than any other human entity in the history of the world. And further, that it is precisely those attitudes and organizations that she favored that are causing most of the human suffering throughout the world. My sister was quickly disabused of her prejudice.
David
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dale
Member
| Joined: | Sat Nov 10th, 2007 |
| Location: | Toronto, Ontario Canada |
| Posts: | 4 |
| First Name: | Dale | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | always Roman Catholic |
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Posted: Sun Nov 11th, 2007 03:23 pm |
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Thanks, everyone! Awesome response. If you don't mind, I'll copy just the body of the responses and e-mail to my colleague at work to send to her brother (who works as a banker in the US) -- was baptised Catholic, I believe.
Blessings to all for taking the time,
dale
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