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Darlene
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 868 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 12:19 am |
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Hello CH Family,
I have been contemplating quite a bit as regards my spiritual journey toward the Catholic faith. In my contemplations as of late, it has occurred to me that this present spiritual journey is not unlike the one I experienced, after leaving the Christian sect/cult. The five+ years of being involved in such a sect, resulted in quite a bit of brain washing.
While I believed that I could live as a Christian outside of that group, I wasn't sure I could ever become part of another church. For several years after leaving the sect, I would make harsh judgments against the churches I attended. (and even those I didn't attend) Often, I felt very uncomfortable sitting in the pews of varous churches I would attend. I felt as if I didn't belong there. The reasons for this were due to the indoctrination I received while there. Here are some of the beliefs I was taught.
1. God blessed us with the true interpretation of the Bible. Other Christians were like the church of Laodicea who had the attitude of "We are rich, we have prospered, we need nothing. Not knowing that you are wretched, pitable, poor, blind and naked." The Laodicians were all those Christians who did not want the gift of true interpretation.
2. Those who left the sect would be under God's strictest judgment. Members were warned that if they left, they would become sexually promiscuous and many would suffer death. So when someone who left did actually die, that was used by the leader as an example of what would happen to the rest of us if we left.
3. If we left the sect, and became part of another church body, we were told we would be "playing church." We were created to hear the true interpretation of scripture and to go anywhere else was at the least, insincere, and at the worst, risking losing our salvation. We were often reminded of two verses in the book of I John. I John 2:19, "They went out from us, but they were not of us, for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us." and I John 4:6, "We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error."
I could elaborate on the beliefs that were taught and the social structure/hierarchy that existed there. However, that would turn into a book. Suffice it to say, I stuggled with many issues after leaving the sect. It took some time to shed that "cult baggage."
Now I am going through a struggle of leaving Protestantism to become Catholic. I have had to shed quite a bit of "fundamentalist baggage" that fostered an anti-Catholic sentiment. Along the way, there are times when I have thought, "I'm just playing Catholic." Thoughts such as, "You can never really be a Catholic. You're too mcuh of a Protestant to go that far." (I actually expressed this thought toward the priest in the parish I've been attending.) Another common thought has been, "How can I leave my Protestant brothers and sisters behind and join a church that is so foreign to me? I will never fit in and will never be welcomed by any of the parishioners." Still yet another common thought has been, "What if you become Catholic and regret it? Save yourself the trouble of this ever happening." And still yet another thought, "Don't you realize that your marriage will never be the same if you become Catholic? Your husband will never accept you and you will feel all alone. Everyone you know will think you are crazy. Is it really worth it to become Catholic? You can still be Protestant and live a godly, Christian life." The struggles for me have been inward stuggles of the mind, all designed to dissuade me from this Catholic journey.
There is an uncanny resemblance to the stuggles I encountered after leaving the Christian sect/cult, and the stuggles I am enduring now. Yet, the graces I have received from God to continue on this path toward the Catholic faith are undeniable. As hard as Satan is working, I believe that Jesus Christ is working all the harder to draw me to His Church.
I ask for your prayers that the precious Holy Spirit would continue to guide me into the truth and lead me home, that I may join in worship with all of you, and in celebrating the Catholic faith.
Darlene
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The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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susan
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| Joined: | Mon Jan 1st, 2007 |
| Location: | North Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 4 |
| First Name: | Susan or Sus | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | non-denominational with a messianic/vineyard/charismatic bent |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 12:44 am |
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Thanks for this post, Darlene. You give me hope. If you can be hopeful and strong after cult brainwashing then I shall keep on trying, too.
I was not in a cult yet your post sounds like my heart right now. The turmoil and angst. I'm physically sick sometimes.
I introduced myself on this forum when I joined way back in early January, I think. I read (appreciatively) all the replies and then I never went further. I'd come back to try to read here and even that was too much most of the time. I've had a couple of meltdowns, too. One really bad one after reading an article on purgatory. It was recommended on this forum and is posted somewhere at this web site but - try as I might - I cannot locate it.
Anyway.... this is my second post and I hope I can stay with it. I need all of your help. I need you guys. I'm suffering so much. It has been a really, really bad year for me since last July. I'm desperate for Catholicism to be true. I want the Saints and Mary to be true. But, I am scared. So scared.
Darlene... I popped in to the forum to see if I was up to reading anything and I went right to your post. I guess it's what I needed to see. It opened my floodgates.... for now at least.
God bless you.
-Susan
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Susan
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CajunRick
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 12:46 am |
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Darlene, as I was reading your post, a song came to me that I haven't heard in many, many years. You may have heard it before:
I have decided to follow Jesus.
I have decided to follow Jesus.
I have decided to follow Jesus.
No turning back, No turning back.
Sound familiar?
The cross before me, the world behind me.
The cross before me, the world behind me.
The cross before me, the world behind me.
No turning back, No turning back.
Except when it was running through my mind, the line went, "The cross before me, the cult behind me..." 
I feel confident in saying you have found Truth, Darlene. You will never turn back.
You just haven't fully accepted it yet. It will come in God's time.
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Prodigal Daughter
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| Joined: | Wed Nov 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Lehigh Valley, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 202 |
| First Name: | Deborah/PD | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptized Catholic, received First Communion, left during Confirmation year. ... |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 01:23 am |
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Susan,
I'm sorry I did not see your post back in January. Wow, what an amazing story! I remember when I first started to believe that the Catholic Church might be true. It was terrifying. I knew I would be rejected by all of my friends at our charismatic church, have to try to fit in to a new culture that I could not understand and was for the most part repulsed by and that it could possibly destroy my marriage. I remember the feeling of my world crumbling at my feet. Everything I believed to be true, Sola Scriptura, salvation by faith alone, was suddenly up for grabs and the only Catholics I knew were the lady at the Catholic bookstore (who ended up being my sponsor for Confirmation 5 years later) and my neighbors who couldn't answer ANY of my questions about, Mary, purgatory, indulgences, the pope, etc. For months I would stop in every Catholic Church I saw and just cry. I never felt so alone.
The journey to the Catholic Church doesn't happen quickly for people like us. It takes time to work through all of the issues. We are here for you on this forum. Feel free to come to the chat on Wednesday nights or PM me. There are so many nice people here who are very accepting and not pushy. Many of us understand your struggles and are either experiencing them currently or have gone through them previously. We are here to support each other on this journey of faith in Jesus Christ. Welcome!
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"Man should tremble, the world should vibrate, all Heaven should be deeply moved when the Son of God appears on the altar in the hands of the priest."
St. Francis of Assisi
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CajunRick
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 01:55 am |
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susan wrote: I introduced myself on this forum when I joined way back in early January, I think.
Let me welcome you again. I hope you feel wanted here. We'll do our best to answer your questions for you.
One really bad one after reading an article on purgatory. It was recommended on this forum and is posted somewhere at this web site but - try as I might - I cannot locate it.
Is this the article you're talking about?
http://chnetwork.org/purg1.htm
Is this the article that caused your meltdown? May I ask why?
Anyway.... this is my second post and I hope I can stay with it. I need all of your help. I need you guys. I'm suffering so much. It has been a really, really bad year for me since last July. I'm desperate for Catholicism to be true. I want the Saints and Mary to be true. But, I am scared. So scared.
We will do our best to help you any way we can. I hope you'll trust us enough. Many of us have been where you are, and many of us are having really bad years this year, so we're really all in this together.
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susan
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| Joined: | Mon Jan 1st, 2007 |
| Location: | North Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 4 |
| First Name: | Susan or Sus | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | non-denominational with a messianic/vineyard/charismatic bent |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 01:59 am |
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Thank you! really....thank you.
wow.... stopped at every Catholic church and cried?
I do that in my mind!! But I never thought to really
go because I didn't want to bother the Preist.
!!! :?
-susan
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Susan
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CajunRick
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 02:29 am |
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susan wrote: wow.... stopped at every Catholic church and cried?
I do that in my mind!! But I never thought to really
go because I didn't want to bother the Preist.
Not every priest is willing to be bothered. Keep trying until you find one that doesn't mind. He will be a good priest to talk to. The others aren't worth your time anyway.
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susan
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| Joined: | Mon Jan 1st, 2007 |
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| First Name: | Susan or Sus | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | non-denominational with a messianic/vineyard/charismatic bent |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 02:33 am |
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Thanks so much, Rick.
Yes! That is the article. I had to check it against my printout. I had copied it to wordpad so it would print more readable for me... and hence I had no source on my page to reference. Thank you for locating it for me.... I tried so hard to find the post that sent me there in the first place. I'm thinking it may have even been a post by you. No matter.... I ramble...
rats... I see there is also no date on my printout either. I'd like to know when this was.  Back in December when this journey started for me, I thought... "Oh! I must keep a written record of this because it will be wild to read back on my wonder of discovery once I know so much more... since I know NOTHING now!" I was really struck with how much there was to know. I kept hearing terms that I'd never heard before. I remember wondering if a Chaplet was a small Chapel.... ?? On "The Chaplet of Divine Mercy" on EWTN the chapel really is a quaint, small one and I couldn't come up with another idea. LOL
Stations of the Cross.... ??? Pray the Stations...???
But I didn't keep the record. I melted down.
I scanned the article but I'll just have to sit down with it and muster my courage to re-read it. All I can recall is that I cried and cried and felt like everything I had set my faith on wasn't true afterall. I also recall being dismayed by the notion of receiving prayers after your dead. It just doesn't seem fair to me. Doesn't seem just (as in justice) like Christ would have it. Do you know what I mean? What about someone with not much (or no) family. Perhaps they led a pretty Godly life, comparitively, but they were somewhat introverted... this person would have far fewer people praying for them. So, it isn't fair that dead people get extra merit if living people are praying for them, because the number of people praying for you isn't necessarily indicitive of what one deserves. A jerk (comparitively) could have been a charismatic, charming fellow and have many of the living interceding for him but the kindhearted, shy woman (or man) who went unnoticed doesn't.. but certainly deserves it. I guess it sounded to my like WE effect someone's salvation.
That's what I remember upset me. I will read it again. Maybe it will hit me differently... who knows.
By the way: My grandmother (dad's mom) was the only Catholic in the whole family. That includes children, children's spouses, grandchildren. So, naturally no one in her family would be praying for her in purgatory. That shouldn't effect her eternity, should it?
exhausted now. ... lol
I'm so sorry to hear so many have had a bad year as well.
Wonder if something is happening we can't see?
Thanks for your reply and concern, Rick.
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Susan
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susan
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| Location: | North Carolina USA |
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| First Name: | Susan or Sus | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | non-denominational with a messianic/vineyard/charismatic bent |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 02:38 am |
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"Not every priest is willing to be bothered. Keep trying until you find one that doesn't mind. He will be a good priest to talk to. The others aren't worth your time anyway."
Thank you for the heads up. That's a good point.
Unfortunatly, the options are very, very limited here
so I really hope it goes well whenever I get the nerve
to try it out. I do know the parish I want to go to so
I hope, hope, hope it's a really good one.
I think it has 3 priests. Could that be?
-Susan
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Susan
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CajunRick
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 02:52 am |
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susan wrote: I also recall being dismayed by the notion of receiving prayers after your dead. It just doesn't seem fair to me. Doesn't seem just (as in justice) like Christ would have it. Do you know what I mean? What about someone with not much (or no) family. Perhaps they led a pretty Godly life, comparitively, but they were somewhat introverted... this person would have far fewer people praying for them. So, it isn't fair that dead people get extra merit if living people are praying for them, because the number of people praying for you isn't necessarily indicitive of what one deserves. A jerk (comparitively) could have been a charismatic, charming fellow and have many of the living interceding for him but the kindhearted, shy woman (or man) who went unnoticed doesn't.. but certainly deserves it. I guess it sounded to my like WE effect someone's salvation.
It is our selfishness that causes us to need purgation, and we are purged with love. When others pray for us, their love is added to the purgation. We don't know how it works, we just know that it does.
Our Church also tells us that our prayers are never wasted. If we pray for someone who no longer needs our prayers, God allocates those prayers in a way we don't understand.
And then there are prayers such as the Fatima prayer: "O my Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of hell. Lead us all to heaven, especially those in most need of your mercy". When we pray a prayer like this, our prayers are allocated by God to the lonliest, most miserable sinner in Purgatory. And when they reach heaven, they will pray for us.
Or we can pick someone, perhaps a homeless person found dead, or a convicted criminal, and pray for them. I pray for a man who raped a family member, and then took his own life before he could be caught. Prayer for him has helped me to forgive him, and I know my forgiveness has helped him to draw closer to heaven. If he chose to reject God's love and be condemned to hell, then God will allocate those prayers where they will do the most good.
We can pray for the dead, and we can pray to the dead. They are our personal saints, our advocates before God's Throne. Their prayers help us to live holy lives.
We are all in this together: The living, known as the Church Militant; those in Purgatory, known as the Church Suffering; and those in heaven, known as the Church Triumphant. Together we make up the communion of saints, which all Christians profess to believe in the Apostles' Creed.
Except the Protestants don't believe it anymore. And I've never understood why not. It is a belief as old as the apostles themselves, and no one questioned it for the first 1500 years of Christianity.
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Ali
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| Joined: | Sat Jan 6th, 2007 |
| Location: | Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 667 |
| First Name: | Ali | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | JW, finally fully Catholic |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 10:57 am |
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cajunrick wrote:
Except the Protestants don't believe it anymore. And I've never understood why not. It is a belief as old as the apostles themselves, and no one questioned it for the first 1500 years of Christianity.
Honestly, Rick, don't you know anything? It's because the evil Catholic church kept the Bible out of the hands of ordinary people. The church was so possessed with it's own power and wealth they didn't want anyone else to know what was going on. When the people finally got a hold of the Scripture's, their eyes were open and they were able to break free. /sarcasm
Darlene -- You talked a lot about your walk out of the cult. In many ways, the JW organization is the same way. At the same time, though, even if it is not a cult, other denominations still perform a type of brainwashing. Look at how evil the Catholic church is made out to be in literature and such. You don't have to travel very far to find all kinds of misconceptions in a protestanct church about the Catholic Church. These misconceptions are so ingrained, that they aren't even questioned anymore.
When I first started praying to the dead was a biggie for me. We aren't supposed to pray to the dead, we need to direct our prayers to God. Honestly, it really icked me out when my dh was helping our dd pray to his grandmother. Then I had one of those lightbulb moments and someone explained it as asking a person we know pray for us, it's the same as praying to our loved ones. We aren't praying *to* them, we are asking them for intersession on our behalf.
It's just a simple thing, but it was so ingrained in my that whatever another (it wasn't just Catholic for me) church teaches is wrong, it was really hard to overcome. Finally by just opening my heart during prayer and allowing God to come to me was I able to get over most of my objections. That was hard to do, I wasn't sure I wanted to hear the answers God was trying to tell me.
I wish you strenght and peace on your journey, Darlene. And a few {{{{hugs}}}} as well.
Ali
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Darlene
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 868 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 11:09 am |
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cajunrick wrote: Darlene, as I was reading your post, a song came to me that I haven't heard in many, many years. You may have heard it before:
I have decided to follow Jesus.
I have decided to follow Jesus.
I have decided to follow Jesus.
No turning back, No turning back.
Sound familiar?
The cross before me, the world behind me.
The cross before me, the world behind me.
The cross before me, the world behind me.
No turning back, No turning back.
Except when it was running through my mind, the line went, "The cross before me, the cult behind me..."
I feel confident in saying you have found Truth, Darlene. You will never turn back.
You just haven't fully accepted it yet. It will come in God's time.
Rick, do I know that hymn, why absolutely yes. In fact, we sang it in that cult. However, if you read my post "Heaven Came Down and Glory Filled My Soul" in the Fellowship section, you will see that I included that song, with a bit of a twist to it.
Darlene
____________________
The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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Darlene
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 868 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 10:34 pm |
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Dear Susan, Thanks so much for responding to my post.
susan wrote:
Thanks for this post, Darlene. You give me hope. If you can be hopeful and strong after cult brainwashing then I shall keep on trying, too. There were times, Susan, when I never thought my family would be loosed from the bonds of that cult baggage. It took my husband almost 10 yrs. to work through all of the issues that wrongly effected and permeated his thinking. Many times he would be plagued with the thought that he was going to Hell unless he "returned to the fellowship." (cult) One time he came very close to going back and I had to take a stand. I told him that if he was going back, he would do it alone and I would keep our children with me. This came about because of a phone call from members in the sect who urged him to return at the risk of his salvation. They told him he had to choose between listening to his wife or listening to Jesus. Believe me, it was/is a very powerful, evil spirit, one that thought nothing of breaking families apart.
I was not in a cult yet your post sounds like my heart right now. The turmoil and angst. I'm physically sick sometimes.
Can you elaborate just a bit? Do you mean that you feel sick because of the spiritual struggle and not knowing what to do or where to turn?
I introduced myself on this forum when I joined way back in early January, I think. I read (appreciatively) all the replies and then I never went further. I'd come back to try to read here and even that was too much most of the time. I've had a couple of meltdowns, too. One really bad one after reading an article on purgatory. It was recommended on this forum and is posted somewhere at this web site but - try as I might - I cannot locate it.
What do you mean specifically by "meltdowns?" I'm understanding you to mean that you read this article and thought, "How can this be true? I can't accept this." and yet you thought, "What if it is true? Am I being deceived?"
Anyway.... this is my second post and I hope I can stay with it. I need all of your help. I need you guys. I'm suffering so much. It has been a really, really bad year for me since last July. I'm desperate for Catholicism to be true. I want the Saints and Mary to be true. But, I am scared. So scared. Susan, it sounds to me like you are going through an abivalence with regard to the Catholic Church. On one hand, you are drawn to the Catholic faith, in ways only your spirit can understand. Yet simultaneously, another part of you is repulsed and very apprehensive to go in the direction of the Catholic faith. As a Protestant, you have been taught to mistrust anything "Catholic." After all, Catholics are not Christians, according to many Evangelical Protestants. There is much that you will have to sort through. Believe me, I know. Give yourself some time on this journey of faith. Take one step at a time and pray that Jesus Christ will lead you into His truth. He is "the Way, the Truth, and the Life." And come back to our forum often. You are very welcome here. We will have outstretched "ciber" arms waiting to embrace you.
Darlene... I popped in to the forum to see if I was up to reading anything and I went right to your post. I guess it's what I needed to see. It opened my floodgates.... for now at least.Praise the Lord Jesus! I am so blessed that I was able to minister to you.
God bless you.
-Susan
God Bless You Susan. We will be uplifting you in prayer. Come back soon and join us or as Jed Clampet said in the Beverly Hillbillies, "Y'all come back now, hear?"
____________________
The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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Therese Z
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| Joined: | Sat Mar 10th, 2007 |
| Location: | Chicagoland, Illinois USA |
| Posts: | 70 |
| First Name: | Therese Z | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Cradle, Cultural, Lapsed, Passionately Catholic |
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Posted: Tue Apr 3rd, 2007 10:42 pm |
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Susan, you said "All I can recall is that I cried and cried and felt like everything I had set my faith on wasn't true after all." If you remember that what you really intended to set your faith on was Jesus Christ, and He is always true, then maybe that will help you compare where you are and where you want to be with Him.
Take it piece by piece. If something is bothering you, either about the "cult" you are coming from, compare it to His Mercy and Love and Justice. If something is bothering you about the Catholic Church, again, compare it to Him. Scripture is His Word, and it cannot lie. If you ask here, or just google around good-quality websites, with references and footnotes and Scripture references and quotes from early Church history, then you should be able to compare more and more what you have been told is the truth WITH the Truth.
I haven't had to take your journey, so I don't know how you feel, really. But I do know what it's like to long for a closer and closer relationship with Christ and feel desperate about what to believe and where to find Him, for real and at last.
Welcome! Keep posting!
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mg57
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Connecticut USA |
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| First Name: | mg57 | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Infant Baptised Catholic |
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Posted: Wed Apr 4th, 2007 12:13 am |
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Susan -
Good to see you participating here on the board ! I hope reading the posts from the others has provided you with encouragement.
Seeing that you have a somewhat evangelical / charismatic backround, you might enjoy this introduction to Steve Wood's story, as he appeared here on this link to an audio program with Marcus Grodi from The Journey Home -
http://www.ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/resolve.asp?rafile=jh_070703.ra
- It might be encouraging as well.
God bless.
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