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Vanessa
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| First Name: | Vanessa | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Catholic, atheist, Catholic |
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Posted: Tue May 1st, 2007 05:01 am |
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Just a quick query,
I haven't heard this word 'Pastor' used by Catholics here (UK). I understand its meaning is 'shepherd' which is a lovely thought.
I had thought it must be interchangeable with priest in the US, but in a post I was reading, both terms were used and so now I think there must be a difference?
Vanessa
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JasPax
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Posted: Tue May 1st, 2007 09:54 am |
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Hello:
My unerstanding is that "Pastor" in the CC indicates the priest in charge of a parish. Maybe that's just in the U.S.
Someone correct me if I am wrong.
God's Blessings,
____________________
James
"Abide in me, and I in you..." John 15:4
"He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him." John 6:56
RSV-2CE
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David W. Emery
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Posted: Tue May 1st, 2007 10:03 am |
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Yes, Vanessa, there is a difference. A pastor has direct responsibility for a portion of God’s people, usually meaning being in charge of a parish. (Bishops, of course, are pastors of their dioceses, which typically include many parishes.) The priesthood is an ordained ministerial function, but not all priests are pastors. Some priests are parochial vicars (what used to be called assistant pastors); others have non-pastoral duties, such as administration, teaching or social service.
David
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Annie
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Posted: Tue May 1st, 2007 10:03 am |
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| I never heard priests called pastors either. i have only heard them called priest and associate priest, etc. The senior priest though might be called a pastor. Though the other priests are also pastoring...:?
____________________
Annie
Ora et labora
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Vanessa
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| First Name: | Vanessa | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Catholic, atheist, Catholic |
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Posted: Tue May 1st, 2007 10:50 am |
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I am glad I am not the only one Annie.
I have only ever heard the word before in connection with the leaders of non-mainstream Christian churches, ie not Anglican or Catholic. Someone who is not ordained in the sense that we would normally use. Of course all sorts of 'churches' seem to be popping up these days. and pastor is the term that would be used for the 'head', because we could not use vicar or priest.
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Annie
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Posted: Tue May 1st, 2007 11:39 am |
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Our Methodist and Presbyterian pastors were always called "Pastor Ed" or "Pastor Insertlastnamehere."
I am afraid I offended my priest by calling him by his last name. I hate this excessive informality. He is ordained, I am not, therefore he is Father Insertlastnamehere. NOT "Father John."
____________________
Annie
Ora et labora
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CajunRick
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Posted: Tue May 1st, 2007 12:07 pm |
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Vanessa wrote: I haven't heard this word 'Pastor' used by Catholics here (UK).
I think you use "vicar" in the UK the way we use pastor in the U.S.
The pastor under Canon Law is the priest who is responsible for the faith life of a parish. He is answerable to the bishop, who is the pastor of the diocese. The bishop, in turn, is responsible to the universal pastor, the Holy Father.
We do not use it as a title of address. My pastor is "Father Guy" not "Pastor Guy".
An assistant is the "assistant pastor". He is responsible for the sacramental life of the parish under the guidance and supervision of the pastor; he is not responsible for the financial and temporal possessions of the parish, except in the absence of the pastor.
A "Senior Priest" is an older priest, basically semi-retired, who serves as assistant pastor, without the "business" responsibilities of a pastor.
Titles vary from place to place, based on common usage, but the position remains the same.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Vanessa
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Posted: Wed May 2nd, 2007 08:22 am |
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I guess it is just one of those things. I thought vicar was the Anglican equivalent of priest.
I only took a step back from the word because I had only heard it before in the sense of a 'minister' who could basically call themselves anything and were not ordained within one of our main churches.
I understand Annie's thoughts on being on first name terms with a priest. Of course, when I was brought up in the faith back in the 1960's, it would have been the height of offence to address him by his first name. Times change, but it is something I personally find difficult in other areas, not just in the Church, and I can feel a little ruffled sometimes, I feel uncomfortable with overfamiliarity, but that is just my age I guess.
Even our Bishop is now referred to by his first name.
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Annie
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Posted: Wed May 2nd, 2007 03:57 pm |
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Yes, and they even call the bishop by his first name in the prayers at Mass.
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Annie
Ora et labora
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CajunRick
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Posted: Wed May 2nd, 2007 05:14 pm |
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Annie wrote: Yes, and they even call the bishop by his first name in the prayers at Mass.
Actually, that's by design. They are calling him by his baptismal name. You'll notice that they call all the saints and the Holy Father by their first names as well.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
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Gnyssa
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2007 12:34 am |
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Hi Annie
I am sure you did not offend your priest by calling him by Father+Last Name. We get all sorts of forms of address, first and last name, father, padre and so on. More is said by tone of voice than which name you use and if you meant it kindly I am sure it was accepted as such.
best wishes
Gnyssa
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Truthseeker
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Posted: Tue May 8th, 2007 06:15 pm |
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hI all
That was my post. I only learned the difference between pastor and parochial vicar a short time ago. At our parish, we address all the priests as Father "Name". I only used both terms to show the relation between the one in charge and the one not in charge, and you would know who was which, because I didn't want to use their names.
Laura
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Lord, please make my will your Will!
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BettyBoopToo
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Posted: Tue May 8th, 2007 07:16 pm |
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This is the way I had understood on what to refer to our pastor as. I normally consider what they refer to themselves as; Father Bill or Father Johnson. If they use their first name then I do to, but when they use Father last name them I follow their lead.
My hope is to respect their wishes. I once heard someone refer to our pastor as Father First name and was strangely affended myself. Just because I've never heard father once use his first name when referring to himself.
My mother was very strict at making us kids always use proper respectful titles when we address another adult. I'm over 40 and for the life of me I cannot speak to one of my past HS teachers without addressing them with Mr. or Mrs even when I am their on behalf of my position as a mother and they are now teaching my son's.
We do not use it as a title of address. My pastor is "Father Guy" not "Pastor Guy".
I was not sure on the vicar or what associate meant though and am glad you've cleared me up on my understanding.
Betty
____________________
Patience
"Whenever anything disagreeable or displeasing happens to you, remember Christ crucified and be silent."
St. John of the Cross
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CajunRick
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Posted: Tue May 8th, 2007 08:18 pm |
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BettyBoopToo wrote: This is the way I had understood on what to refer to our pastor as. I normally consider what they refer to themselves as; Father Bill or Father Johnson. If they use their first name then I do to, but when they use Father last name them I follow their lead.
It's usually a matter of the priest's personal preference. I will usually address a priest as "Father Lastname" unless he asks me to do otherwise. If he is foreign or has a difficult last name, then I'll ask him what I should call him.
Since moving to my current home in 1972, I have had pastors two I called by their last name, one I called "Father Firstname" and one I called by his first name alone in private, and "Father Lastname" in public, since we went to school together. Of the other priests I know, I call most younger ones "Father Firstname" and older ones "Father Lastname", and a few I went to school with by their first names alone.
So basically it depends on the personal relationship I have with them, how and when I got to know them, etc. Otherwise, it depends how they prefer to be called.
Titles like "Monsignor" are still in use, while "Vicar" is not commonly used in the United States. A priest's actual formal title is "Reverend" while a bishop is "Your Excellency" and a deacon is "Reverend Mister". It is common today to call a bishop "Bishop", a deacon "Deacon", and a priest "Father". The personal name that follows is his personal preference. Our current bishop, Sam Jacobs, is the first bishop of our 30 year old diocese who prefers to be called "Bishop Firstname".
Last edited on Tue May 8th, 2007 08:19 pm by CajunRick
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
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BettyBoopToo
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Posted: Wed May 9th, 2007 04:05 am |
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I have always wondered what a priest parents or siblings call him, I've not been around to say that I've known a priest since he was a kid or something. But I've just wondered what I would do if my son were a priest.
Would I call him father, It's just hard for me to comprehend calling my son by the title of Father. ((((chuckle)))))
I've also wondered if one of my brothers was a priest how I would be able to refer to him or how fathers sisters and brothers talk to him. I could see calling them father in public, but what about at a holiday dinner with just the close family??
Have you ever been around a young man and then have him grow up to be a priest??? I don't know why, but I've always wondered about it.
I know it's not a very intellectual thought, I've always been curious. I've never wanted to bother father by asking him such a silly question, whenever I speak to him, it's normally pretty serious and I'd not ever bother him with my curiosity. I just thought others would have had a closer relationship with their priest than I.
Thanks
Betty
____________________
Patience
"Whenever anything disagreeable or displeasing happens to you, remember Christ crucified and be silent."
St. John of the Cross
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StephenC
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Posted: Wed May 9th, 2007 07:18 am |
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I have a little Brother who is a Priest. He is currently in Zambia. When he is with family (it has been awhile) I just call him Jim. (he is still my little brother for gosh sakes  ) When I am talking to others about him he is Fr. Jim. Now when he is around his nephew's and niece's he is just Uncle Jim.
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CajunRick
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Posted: Wed May 9th, 2007 10:12 am |
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BettyBoopToo wrote: Have you ever been around a young man and then have him grow up to be a priest??? I don't know why, but I've always wondered about it.
It's an individual thing. I know a priest who's nieces and nephews call him "uncle father". I know a Benedictine priest who changed his name when he took his vows, but his family still call him by his given name.
Then again, I have nieces who call me uncle, and my oldest nieces who call me just by my first name, and a couple of young people who call me "uncle" even though I'm not related to them. (I have no nephews, only nieces.)
Just remember that a priest is a person first. If your relationship with him is a personal one, it's fine to address him personally. When you are addressing him as a priest, his title should be used. The same would hold true if your son or brother was a doctor, or a teacher, or in any other position of authority. Even George H.W. Bush refers to his son as "the president" in public.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
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