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Darlene
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 868 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Sat Dec 23rd, 2006 05:14 pm |
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Hello Again,
I just read a post mentioning that I must be Baptized first in order to be accepted by Easter Vigil 2007 to come into the Church. Now I don't mind waiting till Easter 2008, but I have another question along these lines. Must I present proof that I have been Baptized? The only "proof" that I have are photographs of my Baptism in the Jordan River in Israel. My husband and a Converted Jewish Pastor baptized me. So are photographs enough proof?
Darlene
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The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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Katy
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | DFW, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 78 |
| First Name: | Katy | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Non-denom/Bible churches, Catholic since Easter 2005 |
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Posted: Sat Dec 23rd, 2006 05:22 pm |
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Usually if one does not have a certificate of baptism, the church will accept a letter from someone who witnessed the baptism. I would think that a statement from your husband or pastor would be enough proof.
Check with the RCIA director at the parish though, to see what they require.
Last edited on Sat Dec 23rd, 2006 05:50 pm by Katy
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Lord, by Your cross and resurrection, You have set us free. You are the Savior of the World.
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JillD
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 682 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
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Posted: Sat Dec 23rd, 2006 05:59 pm |
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On March 6, 1956, the front page of the San Francisco Chronicle had an article and picture: "Baptism at Airport." That was me!! My family lived in the Bay Area and my grandfather, who was an Episcopal priest, was flying from the East Coast to Hawaii. His health wasn't the greatest, so on his brief layover in the San Francisco Airport, my mom and brother took me up there and he baptized me. And my church is accepting that as proof. Here it is:
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"I praise you, for I am wondrously made. Wonderful are our works! You know me right well; my frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately wrought in the depths of the earth." Psalm 139
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CajunRick
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5101 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Sat Dec 23rd, 2006 08:17 pm |
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Darlene wrote: I just read a post mentioning that I must be Baptized first in order to be accepted by Easter Vigil 2007 to come into the Church. Now I don't mind waiting till Easter 2008, but I have another question along these lines. Must I present proof that I have been Baptized? The only "proof" that I have are photographs of my Baptism in the Jordan River in Israel. My husband and a Converted Jewish Pastor baptized me. So are photographs enough proof?
It's up to your pastor or designee to decide what type of proof is acceptable, but almost anything can suffice including a statement from a witness or pastor, along with an affidavit from yourself.
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Br. Rich SFO
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 27 |
| First Name: | | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | |
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Posted: Sat Dec 23rd, 2006 09:43 pm |
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Darlene wrote: Hello Again,
I just read a post mentioning that I must be Baptized first in order to be accepted by Easter Vigil 2007 to come into the Church. Now I don't mind waiting till Easter 2008, but I have another question along these lines. Must I present proof that I have been Baptized? The only "proof" that I have are photographs of my Baptism in the Jordan River in Israel. My husband and a Converted Jewish Pastor baptized me. So are photographs enough proof?
Darlene
You have not posted enough information to fully answer your question.
To be received into the Church through the Sacraments of Initiation at the Easter Vigil 2007 you would already need to have been in the Catechumenate for most of 2006 if you are not already Baptized.
If you are Baptized and generally a picture and testimony from a witness and yourself if you were old enough to remember the details is sufficient to prove this.
Then it would be possible for you to be received into full union with the Church sometime in 2007.
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Fahrvergnügen
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| Joined: | Mon Jan 1st, 2007 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 1 |
| First Name: | Fahrvergnügen | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Mainline Protestant now Catholic |
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Posted: Mon Jan 1st, 2007 11:48 am |
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When my wife and I went through RCIA I was unable to locate my baptismal certificate. I was baptised by a U.S. Navy chaplain. My baptism was probably valid, but without any records I could not be certain. The chaplain could have been from a protestant denomination which does not have valid baptism e.g. "I baptise you in the name of Jesus..."
My parents couldn't remember what state we lived in when I was baptised, or even the exact year. I wasn't able to locate any information based on their guesses.
My wife had a Lutheran baptismal certificate which indicated that the proper matter and form were used.
I wouldn't worry about this. Talk to your pastor. You can get conditionally baptised if necessary, I was.Last edited on Mon Jan 1st, 2007 11:50 am by Fahrvergnügen
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BettyBoopToo
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Camas/Washougal, Washington USA |
| Posts: | 538 |
| First Name: | Betty | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Fist Baptist/Calvary Babtist/Secular Confusion/ Roman Catholic |
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Posted: Mon Jan 1st, 2007 05:28 pm |
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JillD wrote: On March 6, 1956, the front page of the San Francisco Chronicle had an article and picture: "Baptism at Airport." That was me!! My family lived in the Bay Area and my grandfather, who was an Episcopal priest, was flying from the East Coast to Hawaii. His health wasn't the greatest, so on his brief layover in the San Francisco Airport, my mom and brother took me up there and he baptized me. And my church is accepting that as proof. Here it is:
This is so awesome Jill!
Special that you were baptised by grandfather too.
AAAAHHHHHHH!
Happy New Year
Betty
____________________
Patience
"Whenever anything disagreeable or displeasing happens to you, remember Christ crucified and be silent."
St. John of the Cross
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Liza
Member
| Joined: | Thu Dec 28th, 2006 |
| Location: | Naples, Florida USA |
| Posts: | 25 |
| First Name: | Liza | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Roman Catholic |
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Posted: Tue Jan 2nd, 2007 10:40 pm |
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| From what I have been told, there is only ONE baptism and this is all that is required. The scriptures tell us this. You do not need to be baptized over again because of no certificate unless there is doubt. I believe the answer to your question will lie within your parish and the pastor to accept this. If they need a certificate or witness, and there is none...then it may be you will need to be baptized at the Easter vigil. It is a beautiful thing to watch as I did at last Easter vigil of many who were baptized. There were a couple of folks in my RCIA class last year who knew they had been baptized but had no record...so they were baptised at the Easter vigil. It really is no big deal and a very happy event. God bless you!
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5101 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Tue Jan 2nd, 2007 11:16 pm |
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Liza wrote: From what I have been told, there is only ONE baptism and this is all that is required. The scriptures tell us this. You do not need to be baptized over again because of no certificate unless there is doubt. I believe the answer to your question will lie within your parish and the pastor to accept this. If they need a certificate or witness, and there is none...then it may be you will need to be baptized at the Easter vigil. It is a beautiful thing to watch as I did at last Easter vigil of many who were baptized. There were a couple of folks in my RCIA class last year who knew they had been baptized but had no record...so they were baptised at the Easter vigil. It really is no big deal and a very happy event. God bless you!
This is covered in Canon 869 of the Code of Canon Law. If there is doubt as to whether a person has been baptized or whether the baptism is valid, the person is to be baptized conditionally ("If you have not already been baptized, I baptize you...").
According to the Rite of Baptism, conditional baptism should not take place in a public ceremony because it might be confusing to those who think the person is already validly baptized. Instead, it should be done in a private ceremony before the Vigil, and the person should be welcomed as a Candidate for Full Communion at the Easter Vigil, confirmed, and welcomed to Eucharist.
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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cory1977
Member
| Joined: | Sun Feb 18th, 2007 |
| Location: | East Rochester, New York USA |
| Posts: | 1 |
| First Name: | Cory | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lutheran Church- Missouri Synod |
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Posted: Mon Feb 26th, 2007 05:36 am |
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I had an interesting situation. I am 29 and currently going through RCIA. When I was 10 years old, we were part of a "house church" with 3 other families. One Sunday afternoon that summer, we headed down to the beach for a picnic and had a baptism. My friend's dad baptized me. I was immersed in the water and he used the Trinitarian formula. However, later on there was question regarding whether this man who baptized me was even a Christian. He ended up having an affair, divorcing his wife, and a few years ago died in a car crash.
Because there was no certificate or pictures, and we weren't even sure of the exact date (all I knew was that it was August 1987), and because this man's Christianity was in question, this raised the issue of whether or not my baptism was valid.
First of all, my diocese has a form which I had to fill out and have someone who witnessed my baptism sign (in this case, my dad). It is a sworn statement attesting to the fact that I was baptized in water in the name of the Father, Son, & Holy Spirit. My parish priest then signed the form, placed the seal of the church on it, and it now serves as my baptismal certificate.
Regarding the validity of my baptism, we went to the chancellor of our diocese. His reply was that the validity of the sacrament is not solely dependant upon the person administering it. Rather it is the intent of the person receiving it. As long as water and the Trinitarian formula are used, and it is the intent of the person administering it and the person receiving it to be baptized, then it is a valid baptism.
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Br. Rich SFO
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
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Posted: Mon Feb 26th, 2007 08:32 am |
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| Yep, that was a very early issue that the Church had to deal with. Could a heretic or un-Baptized person validly Baptize? The answer was, Yes! With proper Form, Matter and Intent.
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